7thSon

I would say its rather inconvenient because it definitely makes it harder to defend but it is not indefensible. Besides, the actual text of what is in the Book of Abraham is actually incredible and amazing. I certainly hope its true. Im far less concerned with how it came about than what it actually teaches.

Sure… because it requires you to believe something simply because Joseph smith said it was true… with no evidentiary proof… nothing to disprove or validate… so you have no choice. You either take it on faith; become a “true believer” and receive all the prestige that comes with that.. (you’re so brave). Or you call it out for what it is!

I am a member of the Church of Mormon. I believe in the Trinity, reject Joseph Smith as a prophet, and oppose the notion that Jesus and Satan are brothers. But since my church has Mormon in the name, I am a Mormon, and I demand that the world recognize me as such.

@MarxIsRetarded Your right that is a wall of text and a mountain of information. Ive got thoughts that I'm trying to organize. Is there anything there you would like to address first. It'll probably be sometime tomorrow as I am headed to bed now.

Alright, I'm back. So, while I would say that, yes, Mormons demonstrate a sacrificial love to their brethren and to others, as Christ said to do, this still isn't the end-all-be-all standard for what defines a Christian, as a Christian. I would categorize that as an oversimplification. I *do* believe that Mormons worship the same God who revealed Himself to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, in the way that they understand Him, (I would not, as I've seen others do, grossly miscategorize Mormons as pagans, or something as categorically alien as Buddhists or Hindus) however, the differences in the metaphysical and conceptual answer to "who/what is God" are so stark as to be as different as Judaism or Islam, warranting it's consideration as a separate religion altogether. All Christians believe that the nature of God is the same. Whether Roman Catholic, Orthodox Catholic, Lutheran, Anglican, Baptist, or some flavor thereof, all agree as a core doctrine of identity, that God exists in three consubstantial and eternal persons or energies with no origin and no end, that is of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and that all three are one singular omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient God. The argument between all of them boils down to either a question of Church hierarchy, structure, and authority, or of the correct *way* in which to worship and obey God. Further, all are in agreement that the canon is complete, with the later protestant disagreement being that the prior Roman and Orthodox canon are simply too large, rather than introducing an entirely new canon altogether. Mormonism, on the other hand, states that God the Father was once a mortal man, who ascended to Godhood after dying and being resurrected. Already, we have our first major divergence, as this would imply that God the Father is not an eternal being with no origin point. Further, Mormonism claims that Jesus Christ, the Son, was a creation of the Father and born to a Heavenly Mother as a spirit child, rather than His begotten Son. It also claims, if I am not mistaken, that He likewise attained later Godhood. This would deny that Christ possesses no origin point, as well as deny that He was fully man and fully God. We also have the issue of Satan, whom Mormonism claims was a spirit brother to Christ. This further diminishes His status as God, but also then elevates another created being to a status far closer to God as a literal relative. We also have the issue of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit possessing the status of entirely different Beings who are merely unified in will and goals. I find the theology of Mormonism to be deeply fascinating, to be certain, and it is absolutely inspired by Christian theology, however, these differences in identity alone, that is to say, that the Father, Son, and Holy spirit of Mormonism share only their names in common with their Christian counterparts, are more than stark enough to separate it from Christianity as an altogether separate religion, rather than a case of mere difference in denomination or a schismatic sect. Now, if Mormonism *is* in fact correct, this can easily be explained away as our doctrine simply being horrifically wrong due to being corrupted by man, and lacking the fullness of the Mormon canon and nature of God and Jesus Christ revealed through Another Testament, however, this would also be the Christian explanation in regards to core doctrinal differences between itself and Judaism, which would self-reinforce its status as a separate religions. Thank you for taking the time to read all of that, by the way. I know it's a mountain of text, lol.

I've literally never had a bad experience with them ever, and you'd have an incredibly hard time finding a group of people as willing to give you the shirt off their back. The basis of this recent argument is, to me at least, as silly as if any denomination of Christianity was arguing that they were a subset of Judaism. There are simply too many fundamental differences (and an entirely new Gospel) for it not to be considered an entirely separate religion, and that's okay. The amount of places in America where there's still high enough social trust where kids can go out and man a lemonade stand is incredibly small. The Mormons pulled it off.

@wells_sl @ezzyband @BenZeisloft @grok seems rather inconvenient if you ask me.

@Like_CaptMoroni @ezzyband @BenZeisloft @grok Uh huh… so he “lost” the parts of the text that the church claims he translated correctly? Well that’s sure convenient. 🤨

@Tangledweb6523 @kariwarburton It was a great video

@Like_CaptMoroni @kariwarburton I love that video!

Nah we’re not cooked but we can cook (just not in the church’s kitchen)

@MarxIsRetarded No worries... I totally understand. There is life outside of X

@Like_CaptMoroni I'm currently making breakfast for my family and I, but I promise I'll come back to this later. I always enjoy these good faith conversations and debates.

@MarxIsRetarded I appreciate that

@Like_CaptMoroni With that being said; I believe that the Mormons have good hearts, and I will always rush to their defense when they fall under unprovoked hostility from external forces.

@MarxIsRetarded So Mormons don't meet the standard set by Christ in Jon 13:34-35 ?? 34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. 35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another."

I would not, because I reject the Book of Mormon as a legitimate and inspired canon Testament, in the same way that any Jew would deny that I am an adherent of Judaism, or follower of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, on the basis that they reject the New Testament which I believe in, as legitimate and inspired canon.

@dustinharding oooh brother... im right there with ya... got a fully paid off 2016 tundra... takes about $130-150 once a month if not twice

Decided to sell my truck today… 🥺 I’m really hating this economy.

@cgiambr0 @FamilyProjectTX So..... yes??

@Like_CaptMoroni @FamilyProjectTX Matthew 7:21-23 "Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven...Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name?...’ Then I will declare to them solemnly, ‘I never knew you. Depart from me, you evildoers.’ "

Mormons are strong family oriented people. Mormons are generous people. Mormons are often nice and loving people. Mormons, however, are not Christians.

@wells_sl @ezzyband @BenZeisloft As I've stated... I've heard the arguments before... while stronger than other anti-mormon arguments, they are not as concrete as some would like to pretend. @Grok please explain why.

1. Book of Abraham: Direct, Verifiable Failed Translation (Strongest Single Piece of Evidence) In 1835, Smith acquired Egyptian papyri and mummies. He declared one roll contained “the writings of Abraham” (while in Egypt) and produced the Book of Abraham (now in the Pearl of Great Price, LDS scripture). He provided “translations” of the facsimiles. Surviving papyri fragments (rediscovered in the 1960s) were translated by professional Egyptologists (e.g., University of Chicago’s Robert Ritner and others). They are ordinary 1st-century BCE–CE Egyptian funerary texts: the “Breathing Permit of Hôr” and related documents for a priest, not Abraham. • Smith’s interpretations of the facsimiles and text bear no resemblance to the actual hieroglyphs/hieratic. Egyptologists across institutions describe them as entirely incorrect. • This is not interpretive wiggle room; it is a direct empirical test of Smith’s claimed gift of translation (the same gift he used for the Book of Mormon via seer stones/Urim and Thummim). If he could not translate known Egyptian correctly, his claims for unknown “reformed Egyptian” on gold plates lack credibility.

@TARSRel0aded Can one be a disciple of Christ without being a Christian?

Mormons. LDS followers. Step right up and answer these questions. If you do so honestly, we might make some progress on why we can’t call you Christian: Does God the Father have a physical body of flesh and bones? (D&C 130:22) How does that square with John 4:24 — “God is spirit”? 2. Was God the Father once a man who progressed to godhood? (King Follett Discourse) How does that fit Isaiah 43:10 — “Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me”? 3. Are there many gods in existence, with Heavenly Father having his own Father? How does this align with Isaiah 44:6 — “I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no God”? 4. Did Jesus and Lucifer (Satan) exist as spirit brothers in a premortal life? How does that reconcile with John 1:3 and Colossians 1:16, where Jesus created all things? 5. Does the Bible teach creation ex nihilo (out of nothing), or did God organize eternal matter? How do you read Genesis 1:1 and Hebrews 11:3? 6. Can faithful humans be exalted to become gods, create worlds, and have spirit children? Doesn’t Isaiah 43:10 and 44:8 say there is no God formed before or after Him? 7. Is the historic Christian Church (post-apostles) in total apostasy, requiring Joseph Smith’s restoration? How does that fit Matthew 16:18 — “the gates of hell shall not prevail against it”? 8. Is the Bible the infallible Word of God, or only true “as far as it is translated correctly”? (8th Article of Faith) What does 2 Timothy 3:16 say about Scripture? 9. Is salvation by grace “after all we can do”? (2 Nephi 25:23) How does this match Ephesians 2:8-9 — “not a result of works”? 10. Is God eternally unchanging, or did He progress from man to God? (Malachi 3:6; James 1:17) If He progressed, how is He the same “yesterday, today, and forever” (Hebrews 13:8)?

@FreeWorldFarmer @TARSRel0aded It's really that simple lol

Oh, for the love of hot sauce! You sound like a blue-haired libtard trying to define what a woman is. Nobody wants to read your treatise on what the word Christian means to you. Nobody cares. I'm not a Mormon. But I do believe the word Christian shouldn't be this difficult to define. Mormons are Christian. Get over yourself and quit trying to reinvent the English language.

@wells_sl @ezzyband @BenZeisloft Yes, I've heard that argument. It is not as settled as some would like to claim it is.

@Like_CaptMoroni @ezzyband @BenZeisloft You do know that the pearl of great price is nothing more than an Egyptian burial scroll??

@ezzyband @BenZeisloft No. Yes. Yes. Is Jesus not God? Did he not become a Man? What does exalt mean? Yes The Living Prophet through which priesthood authority is distilled down to every day members that hold the priesthood.

@BenZeisloft Was Joseph Smith a false prophet? Do you accept the Book of Mormon? Do you accept Pearl of Great Price? Do you believe God was once a man? Do you believe exalted men become gods? Do you accept eternal progression? Who has priesthood authority today?

@dom_kwok @Kalshi Not gonna lie... I kinda want in on that IPO but id have to sell XRP to do so.... dont love that option though.

@Kalshi the investor who invested in spacex telling investors what it’ll be worth 🧐

JUST IN: Billionaire investor says SpaceX could be worth $30 trillion in 15 years

@pastorryank Can one be a disciple of Christ without being Christian?

Do Mormons really think they are Christians? Why? It isn't disparaging to me to acknowledge their beliefs aren't Christian.

@gwowls Not Christian.... Super Christian.

Mormons are the most Christian