Fred

314 posts

Fred

Fred

@Right_Fred_Said

Katılım Haziran 2025
29 Takip Edilen1 Takipçiler
Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 Exactly. They'd find jobs to meet their needs. They would work more hours for less money if that's what they needed to do to survive. The distortions increase bargaining power instead of reducing it; your understanding of the market dynamics is completely the wrong way round.
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Choxaway
Choxaway@likeuson·
@Right_Fred_Said @GyllKing @hotwings100 No, they'd find work that met their needs. Of course that's difficult with low job opprotunities and business failures, all down to government policies. Goverment interference always distorts the market.
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Gyll King Post Skip Diplomacy
Tesco make £3 billion plus profits and yet nearly ALL of their shop floor staff are in receipt of universal credit. Shareholders and profits directly subsidised by the taxpayer. Tescos are the benefit scroungers. How hard can it be to outlaw this?
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 So the 3m people currently employed and in receipt of UC would hand in their notice and refuse to work at their current hourly rate if their UC was removed? 3m people would willingly choose unemployment and starvation over working for £15 p/h? That's your contention, right?
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@ASPaul85 @DrCameronMurray Income tax tax is paid annually and the bands are regularly adjusted to account for inflation — when these bands are not adjusted, the fiscal drag represents an increase in income tax, which people obviously complain about (much the same way as other tax rises).
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Andrew Paul
Andrew Paul@ASPaul85·
@DrCameronMurray I've been wondering if there is a any story we could invent to justify why capital gains taxes must be inflation adjusted but income taxes must not be inflation adjusted.
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Cameron Murray
Cameron Murray@DrCameronMurray·
A funny observation. CGT, as it stands, often taxes inflationary gains and not real gains. The proposed changes will not tax real gains. Those arguing against the change are implicitly arguing for a system that taxes inflationary gains, which is clearly no big deal.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 If people are unwilling to work for the wage an employer is offering, and that employer consequently can't fill the positions, then by definition, that is not the market rate. But people would obviously be willing to work for that wage if the choice was that or starving.
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Choxaway
Choxaway@likeuson·
@Right_Fred_Said @GyllKing @hotwings100 If they’re not prepared to work at the market rate then the employer will have to increase the wage on offer to attract the workers they need. This is how the market works.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 People on UC have optionality. It doesn't matter if they work 16 hours a week or not at all. They will always have government support for food and shelter. Remove that and their bargaining position deteriorates. This is a very simple concept to grasp.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 The opposite is true. These distortions mean that workers can work less hours or refuse to work. I'll ask one more time: how does someone with no access to benefits feed themselves, if they are not prepared to work at the market rate?
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 Yeah, and that rate doesn't increase if you remove UC. I'll ask once again — would someone with no UC: a) work for the £15 p/h that Tesco offers or b) refuse to work for the £15 p/h that Tesco offers? If b) then how would they feed themselves?
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 This shows such a spectacularly poor understanding of how the system works that I honestly don't know whether to laugh or cry. Are you taking the piss, or do you genuinely believe there is some universal 'market rate' for jobs that gets split between an employer and UC?
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Choxaway
Choxaway@likeuson·
@Right_Fred_Said @GyllKing @hotwings100 Let’s say the going rate for a job is £15ph and part of that is paid by UC. If UC is withdrawn then the supermarket would have to make up the difference thus paying out more.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@flankbruno @investingidiocy Exactly! It's like claiming a punitive wealth tax on billionaires would only result in a tiny proportion of people re-domiciling. It's not the absolute or relative # of people impacted, it's the second and third order effects.
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Flank Bruno
Flank Bruno@flankbruno·
@investingidiocy that's the same as saying this only affect the people that meaningfully provide risk capital... and its precisely that group whose incentives change.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 This is patently false but let's work with it. Why would supermarkets have to increase their wage offer? Who is going to make them? Explain the mechanism. How would UC recipients feed themselves if their UC was removed and they refused to work at market rates?
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Choxaway
Choxaway@likeuson·
@Right_Fred_Said @GyllKing @hotwings100 If UC is withdrawn the supermarkets will have to increase their wage offer to attract employees. They will have to pay the market rate which has been distorted by government interference in the market. This is easy to understand.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 This is good. You're almost there. You're correct — if the government increases UC, recipients have less incentive to work at the current market rate and Tesco struggles to hire at that rate. Now what happens if UC is withdrawn and their employees have less income?
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 No, we're discussing what would happen if UC was removed. I'll explain in a way that my 4 year old could understand: If UC was increased 10x, do you think Tesco would have to pay more or less to attract staff? If UC was removed, would this have the same or opposite effect?
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 This is like pulling teeth. Simple question: If UC didn't exist, how would current recipients of UC feed themselves? You seem to be suggesting that people would choose to starve rather than continue working at their current hourly rate. That's an utterly absurd claim.
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Choxaway
Choxaway@likeuson·
@Right_Fred_Said @GyllKing @hotwings100 Of course they’re employer subsidies. You really need to think about this. If UC wasn’t paid employers would have to pay more to attract the staff they need.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 Employers pay a market rate for an employee's labour. The existence of minimum wage and UC increases that rate; it doesn't decrease it. UC and minimum wage are therefore employee subsidies. They are not employer subsidies.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 Why would they have to pay more to attract employees? Why would the salary become unattractive? What would those employees do if they were not subsidised by UC? How would they feed themselves? It's UC per se that enables people to work less or not work at all.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@likeuson @GyllKing @hotwings100 This makes zero sense. Why does anyone in receipt of UC work currently? Why would anyone work less if they received less UC? How would someone in this situation house and feed themselves? On the contrary, they would work more hours for less.
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Choxaway
Choxaway@likeuson·
@Right_Fred_Said @GyllKing @hotwings100 Without UC the supermarkets would a harp pay a wage that attracted employees otherwise they’d be short staffed. This is not difficult to understand. Paying benefits allows the supermarkets to pay less but as always it’s picked up by taxpayers.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@GyllKing @likeuson @hotwings100 What do you think the workers would do if they didn't have access to universal credit? a) stop working/work less b) work more The benefit recipient is subsidised, both in the form of UC and via their minimum wage. Without this subsidy the supermarket would be more profitable.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@ConnorWHU_ @Josh_Denne11 Fair play. It's mad we still have fans who claim David Moyes was the problem at West Ham. The human inability to reflect and change a strongly held view is very powerful, even when the evidence is overwhelming.
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🏆 7/6/23 🏆
🏆 7/6/23 🏆@ConnorWHU_·
@Josh_Denne11 And I was a fucking moron man. There's still people that say it was the right call or try and excuse it.
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🏆 7/6/23 🏆
🏆 7/6/23 🏆@ConnorWHU_·
He was actually sacked after finishing 9th and making Europa Quarter Finals.
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Fred
Fred@Right_Fred_Said·
@Bielsalmighty @markcarlaw That rich list is 50% PL clubs and we are near the bottom. That puts us mid table in financial power and the 4th biggest club in London. Unfortunately a super savvy businessman is unlikely to look at us and see an opportunity unless we are available for peanuts.
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ShadeBielser
ShadeBielser@Bielsalmighty·
@Right_Fred_Said @markcarlaw Depends on the owners and how savvy they are really. We are (or at least were) amongst the top 20 richest clubs on the planet. Absolutely zero reason, beyond Sully being a turd, why we cant be a side regularly in Europe with some forays into the UCL.
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mark carlaw
mark carlaw@markcarlaw·
David Sullivan cannot keep pretending things will improve - he’s out of his depth & needs to put the club on the market Us fans have suffered for 16 years under his appalling leadership & considering his age & everything else going on - it’s time to go Get out of OUR club ⚒
ClaretandHugh@ClaretandH

Just admit it, the game is up! @GONZObignose says David Sullivan is not equipped to run West Ham. See out the last three games and publicly put the club up for sale. claretandhugh.info/west-ham-opini…

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