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@ARGirisOUT_
🇦🇷 | Thank you, Chainsaw Man
Argentina (usually) Beigetreten Şubat 2022
259 Folgt9 Follower
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@Morningbird_Asa Pochita provoked the suffering, feels guilty, apologizes, and as pure loving act, leaves. Denji and Fujimoto are now free from the burden of content creation and the huge expectations. He gave Denji an ending from the story, not within. And now dreams, can be just that, dreams.
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@Morningbird_Asa It's meta as hell, but I personally love it.
The ending makes much more sense when you conceptualize Fujimoto as Pochita. The unexplained power to erase concepts, appearing to save hero at his limit, the enabler of the protagonist power and ultimately his suffering.
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So Chainsawman was never actually about any of the themes it build up, it was about Denji's addiction to being CSM that he couldn't overcome because he can only find heaven in hell so everything was reset and now he's back to being a PS slave but this time with a heart disease.
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@camperry21 @Marshiipup @TrTriton0501 Pochita provoked the suffering, feels guilty, apologizes, and as pure loving act, leaves. Denji and Fujimoto are now free from the burden of content creation and the huge expectations. Now dreams, can be just that, dreams. It's meta as hell, but I personally love it.
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@camperry21 @Marshiipup @TrTriton0501 You are right, plot goes nowhere, is nonsensical and even rebooted.
The ending makes sense when you conceptualize Fujimoto is Pochita. The unexplained power to erase concepts, appearing to save hero at his limit, the enabler of the protagonist power and ultimately his suffering.
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Fullmetal Alchemist literally ends with Ed giving up Alchemy, the thing he loves and is passionate about, to save his brother.
Having the main protagonist give up what makes them special to save others is not a lack of conflict, it’s a resolution to conflict and it’s WORKED.
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@HeartlessHypno @TrTriton0501 @J0hnnyStar Why would he ever do that? Everyone wants to be the protagonist. Makes sense that he wouldn't ever give up, be it by the narrative or character. I wouldn't give up being Chainsaw Man without a fight. Would you? Spider-Man giving up to avoid pain would be acceptable to you too?
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@geraniumforvash The context is different. Denji is a guy. Pochita is the one making Denji the protagonist. He made his life exciting to see and be, at the cost of a stable happy life. Problems will arise anyways, CSM comes out. It why Pochita, the author, needs to leave for Denji to be happy.
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a lot of yall would unironically hate fma’s ending lol
💤@ARGirisOUT_
@HeartlessHypno @TrTriton0501 @J0hnnyStar Why would he ever do that? Everyone wants to be the protagonist. Makes sense that he wouldn't ever give up, be it by the narrative or character. I wouldn't give up being Chainsaw Man without a fight. Would you? Spider-Man giving up to avoid pain would be acceptable to you too?
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@DrippyyyHippie @Ph414nxNix @HeartlessHypno @TrTriton0501 @J0hnnyStar You can't be serious. Spider-Man story will never stop. Never.
"passed down the mantle", for how long? The Amazing Spider-Man comic is literally running right now.
It's the protagonist curse and blessing. People love you, but you gotta push through constant trials.
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@ARGirisOUT_ @Ph414nxNix @HeartlessHypno @TrTriton0501 @J0hnnyStar Peter has stopped being Spider-Man he passed down the mantle or let other super heroes save the day that’s why Fujimotos all or nothing decision is so stupid man
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You guys have latched yourselves to the idea that Denji was completely incapable of growing past the person he was and that’s the fundamental problem. If Denji could go from having no life at all to learning to love his family to not falling for Makimas bait when she took it from him, the natural progression was learning on his own that he didn’t need Chainsaw Man to be happy. But instead of writing a story where he learns that, Fujimoto decides to have Pochita do it and end the story. That is the disconnect
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@J0hnnyStar Learn what exactly? He beats Makima almost exclusively because he wants to keep being Chainsaw Man. He is renouncing himself to his alter ego, and is why Part 2 occurs like it does. He attached his happiness to being Chainsaw Man, and it ended horribly.
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@ladolcevolk It's meta.
Fujimoto is Pochita. That's why the origin of his powers is never explained.
Fujimoto is Denji. That's why he is freed from the burden of being/doing CSM.
The contract was the manga itself. Observing his good and bad dreams, but his happiness requires the manga to end.
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@SoldadoCereza @sirvary Oh, me olvide de ese detalle. Y Fujino sigue escribiendo CSM, por el amor a sus fans.
Ser Chainsaw Man, el héroe, el protagonista... el creador de Chainsaw Man te hace lidiar con una gran carga y millones de expectativas.
Pochita libera a ambos, a Denji y a Fujimoto.
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@ARGirisOUT_ @sirvary Wow, esa interpretación es muy interesante, puesto así CSM también tiene una conexión especial con Look Back, que probablemente se refuerza con la literal aparición de CSM en su One Shot!
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Tengo muchas ganas de releer Chainsaw man y empezar a ver estas cosas y sacar conclusiones
deepfriedwoomy;@deepfriedwoomy
you are SO close, work that brain a little more
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you are SO close, work that brain a little more
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@WuanGhoul @TrTriton0501 The context is different. Pochita is the one making Denji the protagonist.
He made his life exciting to see and be, but also the impossibility of a stable happy life. Problems will arise anyways, CSM comes out.
It why Pochita, the author, needs to leave for Denji to be happy.
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@ARGirisOUT_ @TrTriton0501 It is a different story. Because imagine Ed couldn’t give up Alchemy because it was too important to him to be an alchemist, and despite the damage to the world he causes he can’t stop
Then because he knows it’s the only way to save his brother and the world Al sacrifices himself
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@Ph414nxNix @HeartlessHypno @TrTriton0501 @J0hnnyStar Kinda, but more like he is required to be protagonist. The story can't continue if he stops.
Denji wouldn't stop because he is addicted to it, Spider-Man because his responsibility decides for him.
The only way they can be finally be happy is for the story to stop.
Enter Pochita.
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@ARGirisOUT_ @HeartlessHypno @TrTriton0501 @J0hnnyStar your point is kinda muddled.
do you think that the character peter parker continues to be spider man despite overwhelming pain because he "wants to be a protagonist?"
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@briff_c Fujimoto es Pochita. Por eso el origen de sus poderes nunca se explican
Fujimoto es Denji. Por eso el autor se libera de la carga de ser/hacer CSM.
El contrato era el manga en si. Observar sus sueños. Pero la felicidad de Denji requiere que se rompa el contrato y el manga termine
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La verdad tenía un grave problema con los poderes de Pochita, y gracias a este debate me lo aclararon bastante. Gracias.
Cada vez me gusta más el final JSJSK
๑ briff@briff_c
En SPACE hablando del final de CHAINSAW MAN. Quien quiera debatir, que se meta.
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@MovingStones_4 @HeartlessHypno @TrTriton0501 @J0hnnyStar Exactly the point I'm trying to make.
The genre expectations forces Denji to use and solve his problems as CSM.
Even if Denji somehow made a conscious decision to stop, the story would force him out as long as the story continues.
Pochita, as the author, frees Denji from this.
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@NidhCthon @AsaMitahawk x.com/ARGirisOUT_/st…
I also think that's the route Fujimoto was going too.
I wrote some thoughts about the meta aspect of the story. Fujimoto literally being Pochita, which explains the why of the concept erasing powers. It's rough, mainly to tidy up my ideas.
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Meta-Narrative: What if the main character well-being was prioritized over the story? It's nonsensical as an author. Characters serve the story, not the other way around, but that's exactly why I think Fujimoto would be the one to subvert the expectations that deeply.
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@AsaMitahawk I think this is perfectly valid! Fujimoto didn’t write part 2 as a character driven agency story, it’s a meta commentary of heroism as a bad thing. The deus ex machina reinforces that the cycle can never end unless “fate acts” (bleak) which won’t resonate with everyone.
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