@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit The world was always spinning buddy even during world war 1 and 2 and my goal isn’t to make you agree with me it’s to correct your flawed logic
@bowsocks@fan_flora42318@fujoillit i'm not backpedalling on any of my statements i still stand on everything i said, i was just talking about the phrase "the world keeps spinning". ur doing this on purpose now lol. i think its time u also come to the conclusion that this argument is useless. we will never agree
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit Dark woke isn’t a real term and claiming it’s not literal after you spent an hour citing 'real world ideology' is just a massive backpedal
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit Not really as long as they give a valid reason for hating that character I couldn’t care less and if otherwise I’d just ignore it but why would that matter in the first place
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit No one said the world would stop, I just said your phrasing was regressive. You can hide behind the 'it’s just fiction' excuse all you want, but equating femininity with 'not a man' is a weird hill to die
@bowsocks@fan_flora42318@fujoillit or we could just continue using the same terminology and the world will continue spinning because we're talking about fictional men... 🤔
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit I’m not offended it’s not like you named any character I like for me to be offended? I’m pointing out your flawed reasoning
@bowsocks@fan_flora42318@fujoillit well they aren't real so they dont have feelings mate. if someone hates a fictional character and you feel offended for them, u may need some time offline
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit I’m not misunderstanding you. You’re advocating for better tropes, which is fine. But you’re doing it by saying feminine men don't 'actually look like men.' You can want more muscular characters without implying that feminine ones are 'lesser' men or 'translated women.'
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit They’re still men and identify as men even if they look or act like a ‘woman’ they aren’t 'translated women' just because they’re feminine. Using 'it’s yaoi written by women” or “it’s fiction” to justify saying feminine characters don’t look like 'actual men' is stupid
@bowsocks@fan_flora42318@fujoillit again, not talking about feminine men irl i'm talking about stereotypical yaoi ukes here. fiction and reality may blend in some places but here theres a distinct line drawn- we are talking about fictional caricatures in books created by women, not real men.
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit So to you, manhood is just a costume? If a man is feminine, he’s a 'woman'? That’s not a 'real world concept,' it’s just gender policing. Feminine gay men exist irl, and they aren’t 'translated women.' They’re just men who don’t fit your narrow misogynistic standards
@bowsocks@fan_flora42318@fujoillit "real world concepts" irl femininity is associated with women so translated into yaoi feminine twinks just look and act like short haired women
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit Lmao always the “it’s just fiction” excuse, fiction doesn’t exist in vacuum buddy creators use real world concepts of gender to build those characters if you’re definition of a "real man" in fiction excludes femininity, you’re is still using a real world exclusionary logic.
@bowsocks@fan_flora42318@fujoillit but you're wrong, they didnt say "men who actually look like men" they said "BLs where they actually look like men" we're talking about fictional one dimensional characters. ur reaching
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit the problem here isn’t your main point it’s your reasoning by saying “we need men who actually look like men “you’re implying that feminine men aren't actual men. You can like masculine men without using language that suggests masculinity is the only valid way to be a man
@fan_flora42318@fujoillit this person explained it very well
in yaoi's (especially manhwas), it's so common for feminine ukes to be caricatured, often having traits that are equated to conventional femininity like being weak, dainty, shy and constantly being dominated by the seme. and because yaoi/bl is
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit You do realise homophobia has misogyny roots so my point still stands and just because it’s normalised in society does not mean it’s true
@fan_flora42318@bowsocks@fujoillit yk outside of our small online spaces, being a man is still associated with masculinity- same way women are still associated with femininity, this is literally ideology taught to us since childhood. it isn't even homophobia- more so misogyny. idk why ur so baffled by this concept
@oxycuts@fan_flora42318@fujoillit “Ukes that actually look like men” do you realise how homophobic this sentence is or are you just arrogant? there isn’t a certain way a man is supposed to look like a man isn’t supposed to be masculine nor feminine he can be either
@fan_flora42318@fujoillit still a niche, majority of them follow this same stereotype because of it's appeal to the majority (people like u) over time alot of us are just fed up of seeing this, which is why u see people advocating for ukes that "actually look like men" not bc we're homophobic