Centurion Longinus

@GlendaAllene @UcheMaryOkoli If you want to to see Jesus in His present glorified body you gotta get to heaven or wait till end times 😅 The Eucharist is a true foretaste of heaven—not heaven itself. youtu.be/RHO8L9477aU?si…

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli I would have thought to see Jesus present in body. It looks like blood, not flesh, skin, bone, hair, eyes, ears….

Anytime you receive Jesus in the Eucharist, this is exactly what you are receiving.

@Rogue0572 The day I stopped picking what I thought was truly good and truly bad as if it relied on my preferences is the day I realized I actually was Catholic.

I'm 10 minutes in and I'm already laughing. He's starting off by calling the reliability of the Church Fathers into question. A "glorious mess," he says. He praises St. Augustine "when he follows the Bible," but then says that once you turn the page, Augustine "face-plants." The cherry-picking is wild. Basically, "The Church Fathers are wonderful... when they agree with my theology." He doesn't realize that attacking the Fathers this way undercuts the foundational, "upstream" ideas he desperately wants to hold on to. If the Fathers are unreliable witnesses to authentic doctrine and practice, then they're also unreliable when it comes to the traditions that governed the formation of the canon. This is important because the canon of Scripture logically precedes (and governs) the doctrine of Sola Scriptura. After all, would you trust the accuracy and preservation of the Scriptures by people who have no idea what baptism is or does? Would you trust that you have precisely the correct number of books (accurately preserved) if it was compiled by people who have no idea what the eucharist is, or what salvation is, or how the church should be structured? Lord, give me patience as I continue with this video...

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Our other great divide.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli You know, I'd say it's a coin toss whether they hate you guys or us more. They definitely get nasty, and lie their little asses off. This results in RCC and OCC folks getting a massively skewed understanding of The Church of Jesus Christ and vice versa. Frustrating.

Symbols don't bleed. The Eucharist is the real Body and Blood of Jesus. It is not a symbol. It is Jesus in His full form.

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Amen.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli I do admire their love of the scriptures and love for Jesus. Those are very good things and the world needs more Jesus like a starving man needs food.

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Absolutely.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli 'll definitely have to brush up on LDS when time permits." Feel free to ask me whatever. If I know, I'll share. Hopefully, I can ask you questions about Catholicism.

For Protestants? Seems like a case by case sort of thing. I like that they're generally very devout about Scripture, but I don't like when they assert their personal interpretations as authoritative dogma. Their quite divided on their beliefs, but they all seem to be unified against Catholicism.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli Those are the truth claims of Protestantism. It's most likely that our religion couldn't have survived without them, but that part confuses me. Do you have a more charitable take?

Part 2 — “After It Breaks” So let’s say it breaks. Not just the argument. Not just the moment. You. You said something you can’t back. You hit the line you swore you never would. That feeling— like everything collapses with it. Like if one thing fails, you fail. I get why you made that rule. “If I can’t stand on my words— I don’t deserve to stand at all.” Sounds strong. Feels clean. But it’s a trap. Because growth doesn’t look like never breaking. It looks like this: You see the crack. You don’t run. You don’t lie. You don’t double down. You say it. “I was wrong.” And you stay. No collapse. No disappearing. No punishment. Just… correction. Adjustment. Continuation. That’s the part no one tells you: The strongest thing in the room isn’t the one that never bends. It’s the one that bends and doesn’t break itself for it. You thought backing your words meant never losing them. It doesn’t. It means this: When they fail—you replace them with something stronger. And you keep going. That’s real growth. Not perfection. Survival.

I admitted defeat already. You win. Growth matters. Standing on your words matters. Becoming stronger matters. I agree with you. If I say it— I should back it. If I claim it— I should become it. No excuses. No retreat. That’s real strength. So imagine a world where everyone lives like that. No one folds. No one softens. No one says, “I was wrong.” Every word backed. Every position held. Every man unbreakable. At first— it looks like power. But nothing bends. Nothing adjusts. Nothing holds. Pressure doesn’t leave. It stacks. Word against word. Will against will. And no one can afford to give way. So it keeps building— until it doesn’t...

Yes.

@GORMTHEOLD25 This made me realize that I'm a boring modern person.

Historical Figures as Boring Modern People (A.I. Video)

I'm not sure if I understand the question, it sort of got lost with the multiple reply under one post thing X has going on. I think it works better if you you hit reply to your own last post instead of positing multiples on my last post (if that makes sense). Who are we talking about now?

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli Do you have a reasonable take that fixes that for them? I've always found it very puzzling.

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli RCC is fine.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli While I will use shorthand like LDS and RCC and OCC when I'm up against the character limit, we've been scolded and told to stop calling ourselves the wrong names. Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but Church of Jesus Christ is fine too. What do you prefer?

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Never knew that. Yes I double checked definitely watered down and part of the mass ceremony.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli So the wine is watered down? Or are you unsure? It's kind of a Greek thing, but Jews were definitely watering down their wine when Jesus had the Last Supper. It was considered uncouth to drink wine that wasn't watered down.

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Honestly I wouldn't take offense in your church, I don't see a reason why. If it happened inside any church in that graph connected to a Catholic church though I'd be mortified. Interesting, I'll definitely have to brush up on LDS when time permits.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli Yep and it sure does piss off other Christians when we take all of that and toss it in the garbage. In metaphysics, Catholic and Church of Jesus Christ differences maximize. In daily living, morals, and the need for lineal apostolic authority, we're more similar.

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli It's unleavened bread still. The current form is a practical development for distribution as modern day Matzah would probably not be feasible for the population density we have today.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli The thing that they use for communion. It's not Matzah like Jesus would have been eating. Is it designed to be similar? Hand a child matzah and they'll call that a cracker. But either way is fine. Does the RCC dilute down the wine like what Jesus would have used?

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Interesting observation, the Biblical reference never registered in my head, but yes they do.

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Yes still living the ordinary human life of a true man. However we have a double collapse of time, which sounds crazy... but remember we are essentially talking about a being that exists outside of time.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli So when Jesus is actually blessing the Matzah and properly diluted wine at the Last Supper/Passover, he was still mortal, wasn't he? Church of Jesus Christ just tosses the consubstantiation business entirely. This means we have no theological framework for understanding.

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli For discussion purposes, I take no offense. To me you're just talking about the accidents. Although technically it would be "bread and wine".

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli For future reference, if "crackers and grape juice" is offensive, what do you suggest I say instead? I'm not buying into transubstantiation, so it creates limits on articulation saying whatever RCC prefers.

Oh and to answer your question no the blood does not become wine and the flesh does not become a cracker—this would infer that that bread and wine are a part of the hypostatic union — which is essentially consubstantiation (Luther) and not transubstantiation. The other layer I've realized is that it's also not the mortal body of Christ, it's the immortal, glorified Body of Christ. The implications for that indicate that the actual human heart tissue and actual type AB blood reported in Eucharistic miracles are STILL accidents and not the substance.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli It's one of those things that baffle the outsider. Clearly, Jesus wasn't made out of crackers and wine, and I think everyone agrees. This is where the outsider is going to smack into a logical brick wall. The video helps a lot. It does go down the "substance" rabbit hole tho.

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Yeah I totally get that.

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli As to buildings, RCC and OCC cathedrals are still undefeated, but thanks. Since we do not believe in transubstantiation, to us it's just leftover water and bread. We're not going to be disrespectful with leftovers, but throwing it away or down the sink doesn't bother us.

You're asking some deep questions my friend. The philosophical discussion about it references Aristotelian metaphysics distinguishing between substance and accidents. It's a dense topic and this is the shortest, friendliest presentation of it I've seen (although I'm happy to discus it at great length): youtu.be/BBZPv_ImH9w?si…

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli My point was this: If it literally became blood and human flesh, why does it still taste look, taste, smell, feel and present in every possible way as crackers and wine? Or does blood become wine, and does flesh become a cracker something like a matza cracker?

@Thundergod9010 @UcheMaryOkoli Yes the gravity of "leftovers" didn't occur to me till I had a glimpse of how they do TLM mass. LDS, you guys got some beautiful churches ngl

@SubprimeBort @UcheMaryOkoli Being berated was fine. Amusing really. I'm certainly comprehending that believing in transubstantiation radically changes how you treat the leftovers. I said "crackers and grape juice" which to me is better than "crackers and wine." I'm LDS. It wasn't appreciated.