@JustinEchterna9 So you just have these cases and others where you need another explanation for wavefunction collapse besides gravitational self energy.
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InformationBot
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@JustinEchterna9 So this means for like the twin slit experiment when the wavefunction of the photon collapse that Objective reduction is not an explanation for this collapse. Nor is it and explanation for the collapse of the exciton wavefunction in photosynthesis a biological quantum effect.
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@JustinEchterna9 or well Penrose's idea might give a reason why large objects can't stay in superposition. But so far for many this is not a limitation that is thought to exist.
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@JustinEchterna9 Cause technically quantum physics thinks now that if you isolate anything well enough from the environment it should take on a superposition not matter how big it is. Penrose idea might disprove this.
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@JustinEchterna9 Penorse might say well decoherence explains electrons and photons but when you get to bigger objects the gravitational self energy is what causes the collapse before decoherence. But we have put more and more atoms in superposition. Soon though things will be big enough to test.
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@JustinEchterna9 So it is not a universal explanation for collapse of the wavefunction. It is an idea that applies to mesoscopic objects. As for electrons and photons it gives the wrong answer for how long their superpositions will last.
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@JustinEchterna9 This is the issue already we have electrons in superposition in chlorophyll that 'collapse' into one state and already we have photons in superposition 'collasping' in to one state. But Penrose's idea predicts times that are too long compared to reality.
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@JustinEchterna9 Penrose explanation tends to be for larger objects this is why he says something like a coffee cup when he gives examples. This is why Hameroff says needs to be a lot of microtubules in superposition. We are almost at the point with nano beads where we can actually test the idea
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@JustinEchterna9 So already we have instances of superpositions of electrons and photons where the so called collapse is not caused by mass displacement and gravitational self energy as electrons and photons never have enough mass to reach the threshold.
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@xenoaesthetics Non existent things affect peoples lives as existent things do. Pretty much everything we know is a useful fiction to an extent
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The difference between imagination and hallucination is logical consistency. Sensory data is no different from imagination, and so for vision from visualization. Spontaneous shape rotation and flash recognition is merely the baseline, the capacity for error and creativity is still infinite.
Gaining full control of anything is both impossible and undesirable. The primary issue with buddhism is the finality and conclusiveness of it all. No matter how relatively advanced based on some frame of reference anything is, it is not final. The idea of enlightenment is incompatible with the idea of progress.
The endpoint of all eastern thought and practice is, some times explicitly and other times implicitly, omniscience. This is demonstrably unachievable, and all attempts at it and implicit claims of it can be summed up as schizophrenia (ignore the negative connotation).
Omniscience is tempting for obvious reasons, but there is no real evidence it is possible. If it were, that fact would be more significant than anything else, by far, for obvious reasons
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The only reason anybody trusted [Jesus, Buddha …] was because of the miracles, i.e., supposed demonstrations of technological superiority.
I chalk it down to hallucination and mass psychosis. No miracle has ever been captured on video, or on the stock market. All kinds of stories about why it exists, and why only you can’t see it, by unreliable witnesses of unsound minds frequently in self neglect, low on sleep, food, warmth, education, travel, and status.
Schizophrenia is more common than you think. As it happens, well managed schizophrenia makes for perfects mystics.
Also, misdiagnosis of mental illness, indeed, weaponization, is also more common than you think. Both are unfortunate. Most of it comes down to your ability to recognize unwritten laws and perform sufficiently advanced deviance thereof. If you want to disobey, you have to be smooth. This also explains the extreme dominance of charisma stat gaming autists. Charisma and coherence are at the limits anti correlated.
And yes, being charismatic 10^x (where x can be any be number) of years after your death, is the same thing.
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@xenoaesthetics You can churn water for a million years and never get butter. Many things only exist in fairly specific ways
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@xenoaesthetics Yes it is also common in novel writers stories, scripts ect. Being able to imagine anything you want at anytime though is less common especially vividly
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@InformationBot0 Precision and consistency of imagination is rather common among scientists and mathematicians. Tesla is famous but he also famously dismissed Einstein as a crank and relativity as nonsense, so make of that what you will.
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@xenoaesthetics There is only reality gain control of the imagination is an important thing it not just about shape rotation. We are an aspect of reality. At base reality is every aspect of totality imagined or not
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@xenoaesthetics He came to the electrical motor in a vision. So it can and has been important for mankind and gaining full control of it would be cool.
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@xenoaesthetics Tesla said though he could never control flashes of light associated with good ideas and various things and towards the end of his life these flashes became really intense.
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@xenoaesthetics The Buddhist have many exercises to gain full control of the imagination. So you can imagine basically anything you want as vividly as you want. In this state high control though rare spontaneous visions can still occur.
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@xenoaesthetics This is why the Buddhist say it is very important to understand the visions and deities and all are empty and not to attach to them even if they are amazing
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