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@mchellap

Founded three start-ups. Clean Tech. Automotive. Football Coach. Foreign policy enthusiast. The Electronic Controls India never built

Se unió Eylül 2009
998 Siguiendo1.8K Seguidores
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Shadow
Shadow@mchellap·
My piece at Swarajya on who actually owns the brains behind India's Automotive industry. This is blowing up, and I am learning from the responses as well! Keep 'em coming. @amargov @astrokaran
Swarajya@SwarajyaMag

Several years ago, engineers at a major Indian OEM wanted to add a simple valve to their own engine. They knew how to do it. The problem: the software running inside their own vehicle's ECU was locked. The key was in Germany. Three years later, the problem remained unsolved. 🧵

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Shadow@mchellap·
@ZohoCares @Zoho Thank you so much. If you help us out here, we will move more of our needs here as well as siteground (our current provider) has stopped India services and proved unreliable.
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Zoho Cares
Zoho Cares@ZohoCares·
@mchellap @Zoho Thanks for bringing this to us. Could you please DM your registered email address and domain information? I’ll request our team to get in touch with you as soon as possible. -RC
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Shadow@mchellap·
@Zoho @ZohoCares trying to move my domain to you but not getting much help with the service. The transfer should have been automatic but hasnt seemed to happen. Can someone get in touch?
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Shadow@mchellap·
Another case of reliance on a foreign provider causing issues! I have had hosting services and domain from @SiteGround since 2016. They stopped service in India all of a sudden but I am paid up till 2031. I have missed their emails about this but now that I am aware, want a simple refund as THEY DO NOT PROVIDE SERVICE IN INDIA. They refused. Seems highly unethical and fraud to me. Let's hope Zoho comes through and let this be a lesson to work with Indian vendors when you can.
Shadow@mchellap

@Zoho @ZohoCares trying to move my domain to you but not getting much help with the service. The transfer should have been automatic but hasnt seemed to happen. Can someone get in touch?

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Shadow@mchellap·
Yes @PiyushGoyal 's comments were ill informed.
Gopal@gopalrs

@mchellap Whether it is Reliance (for batteries), Tata motors, Mahindra or Maruti, there is zero appetite among our industry veterans for even the slightest risk. @PiyushGoyal instead keeps scolding tech entrepreneurs for not taking risk. Obviously, pol. contributions matter...

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Normal Guy
Normal Guy@Normal_2610·
India pays a premium for the privilege of not learning anything :) Every Indian car Tata, Mahindra, Maruti, all of them has a tiny computer inside called an ECU (Engine Control Unit) This computer decides everything - how much fuel to inject, when to shift gears, how brakes work, how the battery behaves in an EV. Think of it as the car's brain. India makes zero of these brains for passenger cars. All of them come from foreign companies, mainly Bosch (Germany). If you don't control the brain, you don't really control the car. Indian OEMs can't even add a simple valve to their own engine without asking Bosch for permission. They can't change a single line of code. They are selling cars with someone else engineering inside. This isn't really about technology being too hard. It's a business model designed to keep you dependent. Three layers lock you in :) First, every new car programme needs Bosch to do setup work (Rs 10-30 crore). Second, you pay full price for software Bosch already developed for Volkswagen so Bosch gets paid twice for the same work. Third and this is the killer every time you want to change anything in the software, even something tiny, it costs around $500,000. So Indian OEMs simply stop trying to innovate. They accept whatever Bosch gives them. The calibration trap means tuning the car's brain for Indian conditions, how should the engine behave in Ladakh cold vs Chennai heat? Indian OEMs outsource even this to AVL in Austria. AVL reuses work they already did for European cars, charges India full price, and transfers zero knowledge. So Indian engineers never even learn how their own cars work from the inside. What Korea did is Hyundai faced the exact same situation in 1987. They set up Kefico as a joint venture with Bosch, learned everything from the inside, and by 2015 they owned the full technology themselves. The sequence was simple - first learn calibration (tuning) → then write your own software → then build your own hardware. It's a ladder. India never climbed the first rung. Why India didn't do this - It's not a talent problem Indian engineers design ECUs at Bosch offices worldwide. It's a combination of things like Indian OEMs won't fund Indian startups to develop alternatives. They demand that Indian suppliers first prove themselves in Europe before getting a chance at home (while European companies protect their own). Middle managers won't risk their careers backing a Pune startup when they can safely pick Bosch. India spends 0.64% of GDP on R&D vs Korea's 4.9%. Private sector funds only 36% of India's R&D, in Korea it's 79%. SEDEMAC - the one exception - One Indian company (IIT Bombay founders, Pune-based) actually makes ECUs for two-wheelers and generators. They have real IP, real patents, millions of units shipped. But even they couldn't break into passenger cars. Tata Motors is literally in the same city and doesn't use them. EVs are simpler to control than petrol/diesel engines. This should have been India's fresh start. Instead, Mahindra's new EV platform has Bosch (Germany), Valeo (France), BYD (China), Mobileye (Israel), Continental (Germany) - zero Indian ECUs. The dependency just migrated from ICE to EV with different foreign names. swarajyamag.com/technology/the…
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Shadow@mchellap·
1. Companies are lying because they themselves never invested in R&D and can't mentor a young engineer, don't work on the right areas. 2. Univs dont do enough real project work with representative projects, have no meaningful internships. Profs who "know everything" don't learn. 3. Companies partly to blame for 2 as they dont collab with Univs.
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Samhita
Samhita@Samhitab4u·
India produces lakhs of engineers every year. One of the highest in the world. Companies still say they can’t find enough skilled engineers. More degrees. Still a shortage. Why does this gap exist?
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Krishnan
Krishnan@cvkrishnan·
@rishhhaabh__10 @2000_vina @mchellap @SwarajyaMag Manufacturing localization counts for zilch for the parameters we are talkin here. Ownership of the IP matters. Having the capability to modify upgrade and make India specific ECUs matter.
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Ununennium ❁
Ununennium ❁@yobiswajitpat·
@cvkrishnan @shreemallatheru @mchellap Exactly! And then people start shifting goal post! The guy saying Hyundai was already a global export major, this & that. Not the point, the point is intent. And ECU once developed, can be customized for various sectors+needs too! The issue is intent & laughable R&D share!
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Mohandas Pai
Mohandas Pai@TVMohandasPai·
Minister @nitin_gadkari needs your attention
Normal Guy@Normal_2610

India pays a premium for the privilege of not learning anything :) Every Indian car Tata, Mahindra, Maruti, all of them has a tiny computer inside called an ECU (Engine Control Unit) This computer decides everything - how much fuel to inject, when to shift gears, how brakes work, how the battery behaves in an EV. Think of it as the car's brain. India makes zero of these brains for passenger cars. All of them come from foreign companies, mainly Bosch (Germany). If you don't control the brain, you don't really control the car. Indian OEMs can't even add a simple valve to their own engine without asking Bosch for permission. They can't change a single line of code. They are selling cars with someone else engineering inside. This isn't really about technology being too hard. It's a business model designed to keep you dependent. Three layers lock you in :) First, every new car programme needs Bosch to do setup work (Rs 10-30 crore). Second, you pay full price for software Bosch already developed for Volkswagen so Bosch gets paid twice for the same work. Third and this is the killer every time you want to change anything in the software, even something tiny, it costs around $500,000. So Indian OEMs simply stop trying to innovate. They accept whatever Bosch gives them. The calibration trap means tuning the car's brain for Indian conditions, how should the engine behave in Ladakh cold vs Chennai heat? Indian OEMs outsource even this to AVL in Austria. AVL reuses work they already did for European cars, charges India full price, and transfers zero knowledge. So Indian engineers never even learn how their own cars work from the inside. What Korea did is Hyundai faced the exact same situation in 1987. They set up Kefico as a joint venture with Bosch, learned everything from the inside, and by 2015 they owned the full technology themselves. The sequence was simple - first learn calibration (tuning) → then write your own software → then build your own hardware. It's a ladder. India never climbed the first rung. Why India didn't do this - It's not a talent problem Indian engineers design ECUs at Bosch offices worldwide. It's a combination of things like Indian OEMs won't fund Indian startups to develop alternatives. They demand that Indian suppliers first prove themselves in Europe before getting a chance at home (while European companies protect their own). Middle managers won't risk their careers backing a Pune startup when they can safely pick Bosch. India spends 0.64% of GDP on R&D vs Korea's 4.9%. Private sector funds only 36% of India's R&D, in Korea it's 79%. SEDEMAC - the one exception - One Indian company (IIT Bombay founders, Pune-based) actually makes ECUs for two-wheelers and generators. They have real IP, real patents, millions of units shipped. But even they couldn't break into passenger cars. Tata Motors is literally in the same city and doesn't use them. EVs are simpler to control than petrol/diesel engines. This should have been India's fresh start. Instead, Mahindra's new EV platform has Bosch (Germany), Valeo (France), BYD (China), Mobileye (Israel), Continental (Germany) - zero Indian ECUs. The dependency just migrated from ICE to EV with different foreign names. swarajyamag.com/technology/the…

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Shadow@mchellap·
@monke_20 @amargov @astrokaran Layers of the onion really. We may address the software soon but think the answer partly is in your banner pic!
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Raj
Raj@monke_20·
@mchellap @amargov @astrokaran Our tech companies codes software for every company in the world, but they wont design this ?
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Shadow@mchellap·
My piece at Swarajya on who actually owns the brains behind India's Automotive industry. This is blowing up, and I am learning from the responses as well! Keep 'em coming. @amargov @astrokaran
Swarajya@SwarajyaMag

Several years ago, engineers at a major Indian OEM wanted to add a simple valve to their own engine. They knew how to do it. The problem: the software running inside their own vehicle's ECU was locked. The key was in Germany. Three years later, the problem remained unsolved. 🧵

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Prince Sahu
Prince Sahu@ps1291628·
@mchellap @amargov @astrokaran This is such an important question. We always talk about factories, brands, and production numbers. But the real power in any industry is who owns the design, IP, and engineering talent behind it. That’s where the long-term advantage actually sits.
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Shadow@mchellap·
@kansaratva @amargov @astrokaran Yes indeed, and thanks 🙏 This is a story of no villains but a sort of deadlock that needs a shake up. Let's hope we just triggered that!
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Kansaratvam
Kansaratvam@kansaratva·
@mchellap @amargov @astrokaran Great to see such a response for a fairly technical subject, and very well-written as well. I hope the discussion leads to better, more dependable solutions.
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Mountain Rats
Mountain Rats@mountain_rats·
India’s UPI payment system now processes more daily transactions than Visa and Mastercard combined globally
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