@PhyGTGoku im pretty sure ss4 goku was stronger than super 17 at the start of the fight, because after the complete idiocy that is the ki blast spam and x10 kamehameha goku was still able to get super 17 in a hold for a while, which implies his power isnt too far off from super 17s
Super 17
Stupid/Questionable
-17 has trackable Ki?
-Goku sees 17 absorb energy and thinks a 10x Kamehameha would hurt him
-17 upscale
-Stupid ass lines
Good
-Myuu betrays Gero
-Climax was fun
-17 emotional battles were interesting
-Seamless transition into the next arc
@PhyGTGoku base goku is at LEAST 400 times weaker than ss4 goku and somehow he just blows a hole through super 17 whos at his strongest here
whats next, base goku easily tanking attacks that wipe his ss4 version out of existence?
This scene is pretty cool, i like how 17 is defeated.
Though they could have showed the Kamehameha from different angles if they were gonna replay it, like they did in DBS.
@More_Jordys if i had to answer the closest one is ginyu goku because thats literally gokus body and the attire is practically unchanged besides the scouter
@Frederickedber2 the turn based mission weren’t even tough. It’s very easily WITH the Ginyu force as well 😭. Except again Ginyu can do it turn 1 while for Goku you flat out need to go out of your way just to transform with him let alone lose allies for buffs
i hard agree. I had Namek Goku do NOTHING even after using him post LR awakening. Ginyu has been goated in those frontier stages
while we are on this topic, shoutout to manga Frieza & STR Krillin. They also have been huge mvps in some runs
@Frederickedber2@FamousDamien He tanks better unconditionally, has super effective hits, and doesn’t need to lose an ally to be great. He also smokes Node 20 and all nodes, while Goku can get caught against INT bosses.
@Nicers62@FamousDamien goku only takes a single turn to transform, and allies arent really an important factor when goku can just solo the boss himself
plus he gets buffs per lost ally in frontier
@FamousDamien only argument i see about ginyu being better is that hes better turn 1 but goku only takes a single turn to transform if you put krillin in first slot
ive tested this goku in those turn based missions and his damage output is so much better than ginyus
hes better defensively too