@_LukeCSkywalker @avidseries I just see the digital world as a fundamentally different place that requires refining some things. I don't find free speech orthodoxy persuasive here at all. I think that's where we disagree.
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Max Shifrin
4.3K posts
Max Shifrin
@MaxShifrin
“Everything popular is wrong." - Oscar Wilde
Brooklyn, NY Katılım Haziran 2016
1.4K Takip Edilen1.4K Takipçiler
Not sure I accept the premises, explicit & implicit:
1. Free speech that isn't *actually* free is fine (implicit: free speech is bad)
2. There can be too much speech (implicit: free speech is bad)
So the question has to be: why are you against free speech?
Plus we're back to the problem I outlined
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Twitter is better now than it was before Musk.
I couldn't post anything worthwhile pre-Musk without getting suspended or locked out.
Sure, there's more garbage now, but there's also much less censorship.
Why do so many people forget what it was like before?
Pedro L. Gonzalez@emeriticus
This app was better under Jack btw Elon turned it into an utter garbage heap
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The concerns you raise are the classic free speech/censorship concerns that certainly apply with great force in the real world--where speech and publication have all sorts of natural barriers to entry that, in effect, censor the vast majority of humanity. You can't just publish and spread your views in conventional print and media. That's the sort of de facto censorship that gives us the space to be anti-censorship more forcefully.
We do not have natural barriers like that in the digital/social media world. It's a totally different starting point, and so applying first principles from 18th century--unadjusted and untethered to the new reality--is a recipe for disaster.
We are extremely drunk on "free speech" at the moment--and there is a world in which we can actually overdose.
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@MaxShifrin @avidseries I agree with you IN SPIRIT
The problem with censorship is always the same: who determines where the door closes? Me? You? Trump? Biden?
Do you see the problem there?
Some people think climate alarmists are extreme; others think "deniers" are extreme. Who determines who's right?
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@_LukeCSkywalker @avidseries I'm looking at this from a common good standpoint, not a subjective standpoint.
We could have simply stopped the annoying censorship of right of center counter narratives without opening the door for nazis and adjacent nutjobs to overwhelm the platform.
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@MaxShifrin @avidseries "Small problem" is subjective. It's a "small problem" is you generally stick to the approved narratives and/or never voice your thought crimes.
It's a huge problem is your account gets banned for those thought crimes.
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Max Shifrin retweetledi
Colin, the marketplace of ideas was a non-digital concept that applied to a world with all sorts of natural barriers to speech and publication. Mapping that principle onto social media where everyone can instantly publish and spread whatever filth they want is extremely flawed, in my view. At the very least, don't you think it requires some refinement?
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@avidseries Did people think the real Marketplace of Ideas was going to be like a farmer's market in an upper-class neighborhood packed with the brightest and freshest produce? lol
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@CoinDealerDCL @avidseries I can make a stronger case that we're suffering from an excess of open-access, unrestricted, algorithmically boosted, digital, free speech than censorship.
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@MaxShifrin @avidseries Argument could be made for Islamism, but they are kind of two sides of the same coin.
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Max Shifrin retweetledi
The transformation of liberals into "progressives" since 2013 has seriously been the worst thing to happen to American culture in my lifetime. Just absolutely gutted so much of what was good about this country. End of a golden age.
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@CoinDealerDCL @avidseries That's not a defensible position if you think about it for more than 5 seconds.
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@MaxShifrin @avidseries Censorship is not a small problem. It’s the biggest threat facing civilization this century.
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Max Shifrin retweetledi
It's impossible to take anything Joe Kent says seriously when he immediately snuggles up to Candace Owens, who is one of the most insane, evil, and sociopathic liars the world has to offer.
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@RiverML98 @JeninYounesEsq @ggreenwald @DMichaelTripi Yes, I can. But the provocation in your example was Israel's existence.
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@MaxShifrin @JeninYounesEsq @ggreenwald @DMichaelTripi Can you apply that logic to October 7th or does the logic seems to disappear when presented from a different angle to the one you prefer? 😂
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NEW: Iranian missile impact near Dimona, Israel.
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@MaxShifrin @JeninYounesEsq @ggreenwald @DMichaelTripi you've been heavily propagandized/indoctrinated.
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@JeninYounesEsq @ggreenwald @DMichaelTripi No, I'm just sane and know that Israel didn't just attack Iran out of nowhere without provocation.
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@MaxShifrin @ggreenwald @DMichaelTripi Oh nvm you’re an idiot Zionist who thinks the bogeyman is the Islamic republic.
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@JeninYounesEsq @ggreenwald @DMichaelTripi You genuinely reside in some upside down fake reality. It's wild.
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@ggreenwald @DMichaelTripi Obviously because they’re antisemitic. No other reason. They were just sitting there, peacefully being Jewish, and out of nowhere Iran starts bombing them.
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Max Shifrin retweetledi
It would be blamed on Israel and I don’t want to even think about what would happen from there.
Aaron Astor@AstorAaron
Um, what happens if an Iranian missile or cluster munition actually hits the Al-Aqsa Mosque? Because this was dangerously close.
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@MaxAbrahms Is this even real? It's so unserious and ridiculous that I'm having trouble believing it is, especially with his mouth being out of sync with his words.
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John Mearsheimer says Israel is more at odds than Iran with Western values.
Absolutely risible stuff.
This comes shortly after the theocratic dictatorship gunned down tens of thousands of its own citizens for protesting.
Uncommon Sense@Uncommonsince76
Daniel Davis- “Is Iran really the sworn enemy of western values?” John Mearsheimer - “No. The greatest threat to western values at this point in time is Israel.”
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Max Shifrin retweetledi
Am not sure why people blame the Iraq War on Israel. They warned against it.
quillette.com/2025/11/05/des…
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Max Shifrin retweetledi
Fascinating to see how the New York Times is treating Joe Kent's resignation - a principled stand from a serious counterterrorism leader - compared to how they treated his appointment in the first place - the elevation of a conspiracy theorist with extremist associations.
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Max Shifrin retweetledi
“This was a lie and is the same tactic the Israelis used to draw us into the disastrous Iraq war…”
That’s psychotic. The Israeli government was pushing against Iraq in favor of Iran. This is all thoroughly documented. ynetnews.com/articles/0,734…
Joe Kent@joekent16jan19
After much reflection, I have decided to resign from my position as Director of the National Counterterrorism Center, effective today. I cannot in good conscience support the ongoing war in Iran. Iran posed no imminent threat to our nation, and it is clear that we started this war due to pressure from Israel and its powerful American lobby. It has been an honor serving under @POTUS and @DNIGabbard and leading the professionals at NCTC. May God bless America.
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