No Name
318 posts
@batigolis @Filbert631 @afneil Slightly lower debt levels?! France, Italy, Spain a lot higher. Higher unemployment in all those countries also even in the industrial powerhouse of Germany. All still in the EU, all struggling but idiots like you think the UK’s problems are caused by Brexit! You’re a clown bati.
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You’re a liar. Even when the truth has been presented to you, you still lie. Liars are blocked. Bye.
Gerry Samuels@GerrySamuels12
@afneil I completely understand you wanting to distance yourself from the utter disaster that is Brexit, but you were 1) a Brexiteer 2) Prominent And as you say, Brexit has been a drag on the UK economy, we’re just arguing the toss about the extent
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@julianHjessop If you want a calm and collected analysis of that the authors are actually saying go to YouTube and search for Professor Nick Bloom (of Stanford University) in the Rest is Money podcast. To make sure that you do not misrepresent their views.
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By the way, even the authors of the NBER paper acknowledged this point! 👇
More on the flaws in doppelganger models in the link below...
(2/2)
substack.com/home/post/p-19…
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Good example of the dodgy stats being used by those arguing we should rejoin the EU... 🙄
Crucially, this counterfactual assumes that Brexit was the only shock impacting any G7 economy over this period, which is obviously nonsense... (1/2)
#badbrexittakes
Gerry Samuels@GerrySamuels12
@afneil Talking of being anti-wealth creation, you must be really mad at the people who promoted Brexit
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@TerraOrBust That is not what the authors are saying. If you want a calm and collected analysis of that the authors are saying go to YouTube and search for Professor Nick Bloom (of Stanford University) in the Rest is Money podcast. You do not have the right to misrepresentat their views.
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This is really important.
That NBER working paper that EU zealots keep repeating, you know the one that said UK GDP is 8% less than it otherwise would be?
Even the paper admits that it makes baseless underlying assumptions that have no grounding in reality.
Julian Jessop@julianHjessop
By the way, even the authors of the NBER paper acknowledged this point! 👇 More on the flaws in doppelganger models in the link below... (2/2) substack.com/home/post/p-19…
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@sw_atkins @Filbert631 @afneil Compared to the UK it has lower inflation, lower interest rates, slightly lower debt levels, better current account balance, lower government budget deficits, and better GDP growth per capita... I mean it's literally all in the table that you reference above?!?!
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@sw_atkins @Filbert631 @afneil France has a higher debt-to-GDP ratio, however it enjoys much lower borrowing costs than us
Germany is in a vastly stronger fiscally position than the UK, but I agree that its economic model has been disrupted.
Quality of life in both countries is substantially higher than the UK
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@batigolis @Filbert631 @afneil France is utterly broke, Germany in decline. Would be nice if you would admit that No Name.
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@Filbert631 @afneil Non EU immigration to the UK is out of control, but the situation got significantly worse after Brexit, not better. Pre Brexit we had mostly young, economically active, fiscally positive immigrants. Now we have too many economically inactive non EU immigrants. Everything is worse
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@batigolis @afneil Like I say, there were always going to be short term impacts.
But it was covid that hit productivity more than anything else.
The members of the EU public are as pissed of as everyone else, not least by the unrelenting invasion of dodgy, idle chancers from Africa and Asia.
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Proves Starmer is economically illiterate if he thinks the EU will be good for the economy
Nick Robinson@bbcnickrobinson
"There are moments in history that will define a generation. And I think we're in one of those moments” @Keir_Starmer tells me on @BBCr4today comparing the crisis caused by the Iran war with the 08 crash, Brexit & COVID. He argues that we cannot go back to the status quo & must get closer to the EU economically & to Europe more broadly to bolster our defence. He says the economy will needs to change so that it works for young people wherever they live in the country. This feels like a leader who knows renewed calls on him to quit are just days away trying to answer the clamour for him to set out his vision of the future. Listen in full from 8 am on @BBCRadio4 & @BBCSounds
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@TimL1970 @ADStrachan @afneil The EU transparently offered a range of options (Barnier's famous "staircase") and it was the UK's sovereign decision to go with the hardest one.
You are free to believe the civil service refuses to take us to the sunlit uplands but it's a ridiculous and unserious position
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@batigolis @ADStrachan @afneil That was the EU's choice - in their attempt to stop us leaving. I, and most of my friends, were OK with a harder Brexit even, than we got. Ie we still haven't removed all their bureaucratic laws. The civil service clings on.
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@Filbert631 @afneil It's honourable of you to admit that Brexit has lowered trade, investment and productivity.
I don't think EU countries are in the crap? Support for the EU is at 73% and support for the Eurozone is at 82%. Trust in the EU is at its highest level ever. These are massive numbers.
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@batigolis @afneil Brexit was always going to dent the economy a little bit in the short term. Nobody is denying that.
If being in the EU is so good, how come most of the countries in it are in the crap?
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@Richie51130128 @afneil If it's working for you, fair enough. I don't think it's working for the majority of the country though.
It's not true to say we've outperformed any of these countries on a per capita basis, and you have to remember that quality of life in the UK is also considerably lower
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@batigolis @afneil Brexit is utterly glorious. Despite the eu trying to punish us, the uk has outperformed france Germany and Italy since brexit
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@Filbert631 @afneil All major mainstream studies show that, economically speaking, Brexit has had a significantly more negative impact than any of the other factors you mentioned. COVID was 1-2% of GDP, Brexit is 6-8%
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@batigolis @afneil The trouble with you remainers is, you conflate every single thing that's gone wrong in the economy and your lives with Brexit.
Most of the crap we're enduring is from wars, COVID and clueless government policies.
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@ADStrachan @afneil We've had a harder Brexit than pretty much anyone pre-referendum was talking about. Apart from Russia and Belarus, we have the most distant relationship with the EU out of any other European country and that's a fact
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@batigolis @afneil We never got Brexit. Our present prime minister was in delegations to scupper any bit of a good deal.
Traitorous politicians are at the heart of "negotiations" with the EU. Our own governments sit back and allow them to whip us at any opportunity.
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@batigolis @afneil We haven’t had Brexit so how can you say it’s been a disaster?
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@gerardtbaker @Simon_Nixon It's very disappointing you are refusing to engage with the evidence, but I'm not necessarily surprised.
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@batigolis @Simon_Nixon That’s a bogus statistic. On a comparative basis, its implication is that, without Brexit, Britain’s economy would have grown much faster than Germany and France in the last 6 years. UK productivity has been stagnant since 2008. Why would it suddenly have accelerated in 2020?
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If you read the piece you would know what I am asking you to believe. But that would be too much to expect from a partisan shill who was against Brexit until Rupert Murdoch ordered you to be for it
Gerard Baker@gerardtbaker
If you're asking us to believe the proposition that the current turbulent state of the world and the risks it poses to world peace have anything whatsoever to do with Brexit, then I'm laughing. Very very hard.
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@gerardtbaker @Simon_Nixon If a policy is costing you anywhere between 6-8% of your GDP, you'd be mad not to be obsessed over it!
Simon is right to call it out.
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@Simon_Nixon People can make a perfectly good case on various grounds that Brexit was a mistake but this hyperbole and the absurd and demonstrably false claim about me (I was writing columns on the subject decades ago) merely underscore your derangement on the topic. You’re obsessed, Simon.
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@GerrySamuels12 @afneil It's funny/pathetic seeing Andrew Neil and Fraser Nelson trying their hardest this year to distance themselves from the utter disaster that is Brexit, and we have a responsibility to the future generations to remind them of those who cheerleaded for Brexit.
Lest we forget.
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@afneil I completely understand you wanting to distance yourself from the utter disaster that is Brexit, but you were
1) a Brexiteer
2) Prominent
And as you say, Brexit has been a drag on the UK economy, we’re just arguing the toss about the extent
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You don’t have a point. Especially when you make the ridiculous claim that I was somehow at the forefront of the Brexit movement. Delusional nonsense which undermines anything else you have to say.
Also, all these studies purporting to measure the impact of Brexit assume any underperformance is down to Brexit. But what about:
— the highest industrial energy policies in the world hollowing out our heavy industry.
— the impact of moving from energy surplus to energy importer on our balance of payments.
— the affect of stagnation in our major export market (European Union) on our exports and businesses.
Etc, etc, etc.
Gerry Samuels@GerrySamuels12
@afneil It’s a totally valid point to make You argued the UK had become anti- wealth creation - and I pointed out the major drag on the UK’s wealth creation, something that you were at the forefront of I fail to see why my point doesn’t stand
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The politics of a country in decline. Not a single word about wealth creation, without which none of this nonsense can be financed. It’s deeply pathetic. If people fall for this left-wing populist drivel we’ve ceased to be a serious country.
Adam Cherry@_adamcherry_
The Burnham manifesto: •Rejoin the European Union •Break the fiscal rules to borrow more for defence. Thus destroying the fiscal rules… •Extensive devolution, including tax powers. •A wealth tax •Nationalise water, energy, utilities, and what remains of rail •A land value tax •A council tax revaluation •A ‘National Care Service’ •Rollout of nationalised bus franchising, modelled on Greater Manchester’s Bee Network •A £2 single fare bus cap •A fully elected upper chamber to replace the Lords •Bring in “free transport for teenagers in England.” •No welfare reforms. •Build more council houses. By borrowing £40 billion… •Scrap the whipping system in the Commons. An old favourite, truly barmy… •MAYBE: Proportional representation. Once behind the No10 door, people tend to lose interest in that one…
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@Rociojorda Just take the L, lady. It was a great game, one of the best games ever, emotions were running high and some of the behaviours on both sides left a lot to be desired but that's sports at the end of the day, and you can't control everything. Valencia are new to this and will learn
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Para mí la actitud de los jugadores del PAO ayer salvo Juancho, Grigonis y alguno más es de auténtica vergüenza pero qué esperáis teniendo lo que tienen de entrenador y presidente.
Deberían de dar ejemplo y no han sabido aprovechar esa ocasión para hacerlo. No hay más
Español
@philjvtaylor @julianHjessop I don't really agree that differences are negligible. I consider the UK economy to be more competitive and dynamic than the French economy, and the fact GDP is underperforming since 2021 is highly problematic, when the quality of life in the UK is materially lower than in France
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@batigolis @julianHjessop Differences so small as to be negligible. France is in the same bind as the UK, even inside the EU.
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Another entry for #badbrexittakes.. 🙄
For the record, the chart looks much the same if you replace the UK with France or Italy, and Poland is already overtaking Spain.
In short, this is a Polish success story, not something to do with Brexit!
Mujtaba Rahman@Mij_Europe
Brexit benefits Income per capita in Poland forecast to overtake the UK
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