Stephen S. Christie

@chickensubject @OpStCyprian @Trent_Horn Yes, and there’s a trend in Roman Catholic apologetics of becoming more political, not listening to the other side, which ironically is what led him to Roman Catholicism in the first place. But he stopped listening to Protestants, which is a bit hypocritical

@OpStCyprian @bornagainrn @Trent_Horn I feel like Cameron of 4 years ago would not be arguing carte blanche that all arguements from silence are bad. It's like after going romanist something changed.

In fact there are good and bad arguments from silence as @bornagainrn & I mentioned to @Trent_Horn. How Protestants Argue Like Atheists According to Special Guest Trent Horn youtube.com/live/-wfBOSSjq…

@MrCasey62 You insist that it is the literal flesh and the literal blood of Jesus in the Eucharist, just that they appear to be bread and wine. But that’s not cannibalism?

“I love it when people accuse us of cannibalism. If your beliefs about the Eucharist COULDN’T be mistaken for cannibalism, then you don’t believe what the Early Christians believed.”

@StephenBoyce333 @TheCynicogue @HwsEleutheroi @StephenBoyce333 so when Jesus is referred to as the blessed “hope“ does that mean Christians don’t believe He existed or are doubting if He’s going to return? No. Dr. White is using “Hope“ in the same way.

@bornagainrn @TheCynicogue @HwsEleutheroi “I hope he existed” isn’t a statement of believing someone exists btw. You guys are the dishonest ones and quite frankly I’m done interacting with delusion. Enjoy your long wasted days on X talking in circles. ✌️

I will be responding to this graphic from @StephenBoyce333 on the Dividing Line, hopefully tomorrow. It is sad to see what has become of him. I assume he does this to soothe his conscience, to be honest. It is a common ploy of "converts." Sort of a way to show your commitment to your new religion. But, it is so desperately dishonest. He knows better. I have provided HOURS of refutation of this lie. But, anyway, Ignatius existed---the "standard" time frame and narrative may well be true, but, for those of us who actually take the faith into the battlefield against Unitarians and Mormons and JWs and Muslims, etc., honesty about the textual tradition behind our Ignatian corpus must be a priority. Doesn't really matter to Romanists...they abandoned history when they bowed the knee to Newman anyway. BTW, you can find those hours of programs by searching for "Ignatius" at aomin.org. Oh, btw, the big irony here is: Ignatius did not address a "bishop" (singular) at Rome because...there wasn't a monarchical episcopate there as yet. And now Boyce pretends to follow a man whose very office forces him (Boyce) to believe otherwise. Gotta love the irony.

@StephenBoyce333 @TheCynicogue @HwsEleutheroi @StephenBoyce333 so everyone is wrong but you: Dr. White, Joe Heschmeyer, and others responding to you? You’re the only one who is “right,“ & everyone else is dishonest & delusional? Sounds like pride to me. You might want to examine YOURSELF.

@StephenBoyce333 @TheCynicogue @HwsEleutheroi @StephenBoyce333 “I hope” is hyperbolic language. Why would he question his existence since he has used him as HISTORICAL evidence for decades? Ever think YOU are the one who is misunderstanding & dishonest? Look how at your personal attacks & your lying meme

@StephenBoyce333 @TheCynicogue @StephenBoyce333 we aren’t defending him for that reason. You’re twisting what he said, which you refuse to acknowledge. And you aren’t entertaining the possibility YOU might be wrong & now you’re throwing even Joe under the bus. Your meme is a lie, yes?

I don’t care if Joe is wrong or not. People aren’t having that debate in scholarship. If there’s one random guy talking about it, fine. Otherwise Joe would be incorrect too. White is way off in his “central view”. It’s just not true and you guys are willing to defend him to the death on this and it’s astonishing.

@StephenBoyce333 @TheCynicogue @HwsEleutheroi @StephenBoyce333 you’re twisting what Dr. White said. He did NOT say it IS the central view. He said it is BECOMING the central view. You’re still ignoring your meme, which generated all this, misleading others that he SAID Ignatius didn’t exist.

@TheCynicogue @bornagainrn @HwsEleutheroi Price does not deny his existence but his authorship. I know that for a fact because I interact with Price. And here’s White saying it’s the central view.

@TheCynicogue @StephenBoyce333 Dr Boyce is so prideful that he won’t even consider “some” of what he sad or done is wrong, especially the meme. He just posts laughing emojis on Facebook when confronted about it.

@bornagainrn @StephenBoyce333 I think this is a fair criticism. A lot of people seem to be misrepresenting Dr. White’s point. I haven’t seen the debate since it happened, but I recall his point being that the matter is simply debated because the evidence surrounding Ignatius is less than ideal.

@TheCynicogue @StephenBoyce333 Yes, and that was all the context Dr White was trying to get across. Sadly, Joe & Dr Boyce strawmanned his point & even misquoted him for no other reason than to discredit him. He can’t or won’t see his meme was extremely dishonest & misleading.

@TheCynicogue @StephenBoyce333 That’s fair, but it is still sad Dr Boyce won’t accurately depict what Dr White ACTUALLY said, but twisted it, especially in the meme; outright lying because he never said that, & people are believing now that he did. So much for not bearing false witness!

@bornagainrn @StephenBoyce333 That sounds more accurate. And to be fair to Dr. Boyce, even that is probably too much for my liking. I would not argue that this view is becoming central, although it is certainly becoming more popular than it was before. But it is definitely still fringe.

@StephenBoyce333 @TheCynicogue youtube.com/shorts/ukRnpy-…

White said this is the view of the majority of scholarship to Joe. Which is it? Fringe or majority? And no one in the field of Ignatian studies believes that Ignatius was a myth. I’m sure some uneducated YouTuber who lives in his parent’s basement says stupid things like that, but that’s not a scholastic view.

@TheCynicogue @StephenBoyce333 What Dr Boyce did was twist what Dr White said, which he said there is “growing skepticism” & when Joe said it was just fringe, he simply said it is BECOMING central, not that it IS central. Still Dr Boyce disagrees with Joe even on fringe but he ignores that

@StephenBoyce333 @bornagainrn @HwsEleutheroi No, there are real scholars who have this view. Again, fringe, but they absolutely exist. Dr. Robert Price immediately comes to mind, but there are others. I don’t think White ever said this was a majority view. If he did, I’d love to see it, & will gladly concede the point.

@StephenBoyce333 @TheCynicogue And you STILL have no conviction posting a meme accusing Dr White of saying to Ignatius “You didn’t even exist,” MISLEADING people into believing he actually SAID that? THAT doesn’t bother you?? What does that say about you Dr Boyce??

@StephenBoyce333 @TheCynicogue You are lying again Dr Boyce! He said there is a growing SKEPTICISM of scholars of whether he existed & when Joe said it is a fringe view, he said it’s BECOMING the central view. BTW, I own my own home which I paid off when I was 49. Nice ad hominem!

@StephenBoyce333 @StephenBoyce333 what’s really sad is how much time you & other Catholics spent on an irrelevant comment said in passing during a debate on a different topic from 1 year ago just to attempt to discredit him? Is this the direction of Catholic apologetics?

No one in contemporary scholarship believes this. That is the problem, and you guys do not seem to grasp it. The real debates in modern scholarship are not about whether Ignatius existed, but about his corpus: how many letters are authentic, when they were written, and which recension preserves the earliest form. I know mythicists who deny the existence of Jesus of Nazareth, yet even they do not deny the existence of Ignatius of Antioch.

@StephenBoyce333 @StephenBoyce333 your refusal to acknowledge your meme was purposely misleading, is as bad, if not worse, than what you’re accusing Dr White of doing just exposed your hypocrisy. You really don’t care it led people to believe Dr White said he didn’t exist??

@StephenBoyce333 @StephenBoyce333 congratulations, by you claiming “no one” in contemporary scholarship believes this, you just contradicted Joe Heschmeyer who conceded during their debate that it is a “fringe view” - meaning NOT “no one.”

@StephenBoyce333 You are still ignoring, and not taking accountability for posting, an extremely misleading meme, which people are now convinced Dr. White said this because of the meme. The fact you’re not conceding it is misleading is troubling.

@bornagainrn @HwsEleutheroi I didn’t misspeak in a debate and then buckle down and defend it more, while making an absurd comment about modern scholarship that doesn’t exist. Get over yourself. No one was exposed here

@StephenBoyce333 @HwsEleutheroi Yeah, that’s not what actually happened. You are simply denying the mainstream scholarship. He is addressing this right now around the 13 minute mark & even challenged you to debate. Put your $ where your mouth is: youtube.com/live/oDqbUC21S…