m1ndc0re53

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted You are completely ignoring everything I said, as I see you don't have anything different to say, i'm calling it done, you didn't counter any of my arguments, AI users can be artists, ideas is all you need to be art, whether it's AI, photo, oil or mud.

@mindcore53 @korrupted You're saying it exactly. AI can be used by artists. Meaning you were already an artist before using AI. Using the AI in itself makes you an artist? NO. Why? Because the machine is making the image for you. Are you a chef just for eating at restaurants? NO.

I'm getting tired of this debate. But there is one thing I want to understand. If you are an artist for asking an AI to do an image for you.... Then am I artist for asking a person to draw something for me?

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted first tell me, do you think there's creativity involved into this image?

@mindcore53 @korrupted Did you make the image?

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted swords can be used by swordsmen, AI can be used by artist... don't know how that's supposed to contribute to your argument.

@mindcore53 @korrupted Exactly that

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted yea and Sam altman is not an artist just for creating chatgpt... what's your point?

@korrupted @mindcore53 The Lumière brothers did a functioning filming camera and they weren't artists. I made a sword with a stick and I'm not a swordsman. Einstein helped making the atomic bomb and he was not a soldier, nor a pilot.

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted it becomes art because it trascends the moment of sattire he was trying to make, being disruptive and breaking the settled standards of art it the most artistic expression ever... hey, just like AI is doing right now!

@mindcore53 @korrupted Correct, a picture of my cat can be art. But the photo itself doesn't have to be. Also, Duchamp with those pieces was making a satire or a critique. People didn't understand and thought it was art but he was saying the opposite, it was a satire

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted "you are not artist, you are a photographer" lol

@mindcore53 @korrupted Then you're good at using the AI, not at creating the art, because it's the AI making and composing the piece

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted it's about knowing your tool, even with the best ideas, if you don't know the difference between a 18mm and a 300mm lens you probably won't get a good result, and learning how cameras works like full frame sensors, HDR, E-TTL its not 'art' terminology.

@korrupted @mindcore53 Then you're confirming what I said, the "artist" here is the AI, it's the AI who knows all that stuff to create a piece that you want. It does it with your direction, but it's the AI who did it

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted hmmm but how do you know there's no though behind involved? do you think that from this AI image? would you call it art if there was a creative process behind an AI image?

@mindcore53 @korrupted Because that's not the case in most AI productions. In fact, most times there isn't even a creative process behind. I take a photo of my cat, just a photo, no thought behind, that's not art, I just pressed a button and got a photo.

@korrupted @Giantess_Lily i can agree to this in part, i would say that cat picture "can" be art, the potential is there, the only step forward is the intention of the creator to make it art, Duchamp put a snow shovel on a museum and called it art, he just proved the intention is all u need to become art.

@Giantess_Lily @mindcore53 I think the disconnect is that many people only consider something 'art' because of the perceived time involved creating it, or the perceived process or skills involved with creating it. To which I respectfully have to disagree. Your cat picture, I consider art. Captured moment

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted no, chefs dont either, they have an army of cookers and he just there to ensure everything is going as he intended, film directors dont grab a camera either, music directors dont play any instrument, art director dont draw anything....

@mindcore53 @korrupted Question. You give specific recipes, timing, temps, etc to a restaurant. Are YOU making the dish? Just yes or no. Are YOU the one cooking?

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted for example if you want more vivid colors, you would use CFG at 7 when using SDXL models, lower it for more dull colors, CFG isn't a color slider actually, it's how much guidance the model have (prompt adherence) but artists use it to make more realistic images, not that easy tho

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted hmmm... do you think learning how anatomy works, or how optics works helps you to improve at drawing? learning how AI actually works can give you new ways of using AI and having unique results...

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted yes! but you don't separate creativity/ideas from execution here, both are artist merits, why do you separate it when it comes to AI? of course there's creativity before shooting, why don't you apply it to AI too? it's incoherent.

@mindcore53 @korrupted Photography is not just the camera. The creative process is made by the photographer so no. You really insist on the camera and fail to see who did the creative process

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted a 5 star kitchen have a hierarchical structure to become a chef, let's say you mean the knowledge of the chef itself, if you can give specific recipes, timing, temps, etc to a restaurant and they are willing to do it exactly, then yes, making AI images is similar to being a chef.

@mindcore53 @korrupted Counter question. Where there do I say you don't need any skill to be an artist? Other example. Am I a chef for asking food in a restaurant? Where am I saying you don't need skill to cook? This ain't about skill, it's about entitlement

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted so an award winning photography is made by cameras right? not photographers?

@mindcore53 @korrupted Are we even talking about the same thing? You know how to run that stable diffusion server? Perfect. It's still the AI making the work, because everything related to the art is made by the AI. The logistical is done by you, perfect, you're not the one creating the piece

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted stay with the next thing he said, you would value AI work more after you learn to setup a python virtual environment for rxample

@korrupted @mindcore53 Is that answer for me or the other guy?

@korrupted @Giantess_Lily comfyui is also stable diffusion did you know? xD

@Giantess_Lily @mindcore53 "stable diffusion server" Haha, someone googled. Stable diffusion is old at this point. The best answer I can give you, is to give it a run. Learn to create a workflow, call a model, utilize nodes for control nets, etc... and you'll have a MUCH different opinion about AI.

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted what was your point when you said 'am i an artist if i ask an artist to make something for me?'

@mindcore53 @korrupted Read. Again.

@Giantess_Lily @korrupted you main point was you don't need any skill to use AI, he tried to explain why it's absurd to think like that, telling a photographer 'nice camera' is absurd, you just don't want to realize that you still need to learn how to make good AI images, starting from fundamentals.

@korrupted @mindcore53 You are taking offense because you think my post is calling you out. But if it's true (I assume it is) you are a photographer, gaffer, etc etc then this post was never intended for you. You are an artist using AI. If using AI is good or bad is not the concern of my post