Run it back (again)

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg Green doesn't have the authority to do that, that's also on Staios. Green can't fire other coaches.

@ITheSpace @GatineauGreg I agree that Staios should have done something sooner. The flags were there in the preseason. But you said Yeo doesn't deserve credit b/c he doesn't coach the goalies. I asked why Green shouldn't be accountable for addressing the goalie coach (who does) as well.

It’s truly amazing what Green did with this group. Every player has bought in and plays a 200’ game. Playoff hockey mentality all season.

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg Actually it was more like an .830 sv% lol, you could have 4 Lidstroms being coached by Scotty Bowman killing penalties with those numbers your PK% is going to be awful.

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg Because the Sens had literally 0 goalies. Leevi had to play 10 games in a row and put up an .860 Sv%. No amount of changing the PK coach was going to fix their numbers, all they could do was wait until Ullmark returned and hope he stabilized, which he has.

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg If anything it should be Staios getting the blame for not addressing the goaltending until it was probably too late. Again, the difference between Baumgartner and Yeo pales in comparison to the difference between Leevi and Ullmark post-return.

@ITheSpace @GatineauGreg OK, so then if we agree that coaching was A factor, why should Green not be held accountable for not addressing the coaching--either on the PK, or at the goaltending position, where you think 90% of the problem was--for so much of the season?

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg So, yes Mike Yeo deserves *some credit* for turning them from 2nd best into best, but he doesn't deserve credit for the goaltending going from league worst to 18th-best because he doesn't coach the goalies.

@ITheSpace @GatineauGreg OK, but you said it was the "only" factor, not the "biggest factor by far." Which is it? Not attacking you, just want to be clear about where we're at in the conversation before continuing.

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg "Only" was probably a slight hyperbole, but it's like 90% goaltending. On the year the Sens are 2nd in xGA/60 on the PK and 32nd in GSAx Over their past 20 games, the Sens are up 1 spot to 1st in xGA/60 but their goaltending has jumped from dead last to 18th-best.

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg They have impact on HOW THEY DEFEND, not on how many goals actually go in. If their xG on the PK was bad then I would agree with you, but it's not.

@ITheSpace @GatineauGreg You said: "The PK was only ever an issue because of goaltending." "Only" means there is a single factor involved. I think I'm understanding you: You're saying the coaches, Baumgartner/Yeo, had no impact on the PK because goaltending was the only factor. Is that not correct?

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg Yeo taking over the PK coincided with Ullmark returning, and he's had a perfectly fine sv% since, and lo and behold the PK magically doesn't stink anymore. The goaltending is the difference, not Mike Yeo.

@ITheSpace @GatineauGreg So one coach matters, but the others don't?

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg You're not understanding what I'm saying. The coaching matters in terms of the process. Their expected goals against on the PK has been elite all year long, their 5v5 and 4v5 goaltending was horrendous. That's why the PK stunk.

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg Green has an impact on the process because he is responsible for the system and getting guys to play it properly but the results are on goaltending more than coaching or anything else. The Sens process is very good, both at 5v5 and on the PK. He can't force goalies to make saves.

@ITheSpace @GatineauGreg OK, so then let's extrapolate here. You're saying the change to Yeo had no impact. Which would mean that coaching has no impact. Which would mean that Green, as a coach, also has no impact.

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg Yeo took over the PK the same exact day Ullmark returned from his leave of absence, which is when the goaltending stabilized. That's why the PK is better now. Their xGA/60 on the PK was always among the lowest in the league, only now is that being reflected.

@ITheSpace @GatineauGreg If the PK failure was "only b/c of goaltending," then what you're suggesting is that switching from Baumgartner to Yeo running the PK magically made the goalies able to make saves. Think about that.

@GordsTake @GatineauGreg How can you possibly think he isn't the right coach? What other coach would get this amount of buy-in from the players? The PK was only ever an issue because of goaltending. Green can't put the pads on.

@GatineauGreg I think Green has mismanaged the roster all season. His refusal to adjust on the PK cost this team wins. But the overall team defense is top notch. I still don't think he's the right coach, but I don't think he's the wrong one anymore, either.

@rafael__1331 @domluszczyszyn I can't post long replies but you're comparing a season where Werenski and Hutson's underlyings are basically the exact same and Werenski has more points to a season where Caufield put up half as many points as the guy you're comparing him too

@ITheSpace @domluszczyszyn caufield pace under DD: 3 G, 19 A, 22P caufield pace under MSL: 49 G, 29 A, 78P actual stats: 23 G, 20 A, 43P Debrincat stats: 41 G, 37 A, 78 P ur telling me u think caufield had a better season than debrincat in 2022???? be deadass

NHL Awards Watch 🏆 Kucherov pulls to neck-and-neck with MacKinnon after a Gretzkian stretch and the best Norris race in ages continues to heat up. nytimes.com/athletic/71384…

@rafael__1331 @domluszczyszyn

@00dakota_00 @domluszczyszyn I don't need to read it, and I'm currently busy replying to someone else. It's a statistical fact that Makar is being used less defensively THIS YEAR than each of his two Norris seasons. He is being sheltered, I'm not sure why, but the numbers bear it out.

@rafael__1331 @domluszczyszyn If Berube got fired halfway through the year and DeBoer took over and suddenly Matthews turned back into a 60 goal scorer for 40 games, you wouldn't say "well actually he's still had a worse season than Stutzle because Stutzle still has more points overall"

@ITheSpace @domluszczyszyn probably true but this is for the whole season not just 20 games he’s been worse than hutson defensively throughout the whole season

@rafael__1331 @domluszczyszyn Sure, but playing a in system that made you a lottery team under Coach A and then turning into a juggernaut when Coach B takes over is not a coincidence.

@rafael__1331 @domluszczyszyn *since around the time he took over. CBJ has played 25 games under Bowness but MP only lets you look at last 10 or 20 games. But since Bowness took over, Werenski has absolutely been better defensively than Hutson while also putting up more points.

@rafael__1331 @domluszczyszyn This also doesn't account for the fact that Columbus was horrible under Evason because he is a terrible coach and since Bowness took over, Werenski's xGA/60 is 2.15 to Hutson's 2.65.

@rafael__1331 @domluszczyszyn No, because Matheson gets absolutely crushed in those minutes, are you retarded? He's running a 46% xG share. The argument in favor of Werenski is his numbers WEIGHED against his usage. Matheson's numbers are dogshit so no, I obviously don't care about his usage.

@ITheSpace @domluszczyszyn unless you wanna concede matheson is a better Dman than werenski bc he gets more DZone starts