The White Stone 🇨🇦

So creation ex nihilo was a one time thing? If he had the ability to do that, why bother with avoiding doing it afterwards? If he created Adam from dust and wine from water, it isn't a big stretch to say he created the world from matter that already existed. Creation ex-nihilo is an idea formed long after the apostolic age to align Christianity with Greek philosophy and the pattern we see in the Bible is Christ creating things from other things. He willed the atomic particles of the water to rearrange themselves into wine, he didn't break the laws of conservation of matter and have wine pop into existence from nothing.

But my point is that He did though. Because He made the Universe, and the light, the elements, the planets, the Garden, the clay. Then combined these elements to create a being with more than just the physical. An invisible mind also and breathed into him a living spirit of life. Creating a brand new thing. A being of 3 parts living in 3 realms simultaneously. Physical (the flesh) Mental (the battlefield) Spiritual (the victory) It's interesting to me that Joseph chose similar words for his 3 realms or kingdoms of heaven. (forgive me if I have the terminology a bit off) Terrestrial (means earth) Telestial (means distant or end) Celestial (means heavenly or eternal)

Can something be both "created" and "eternal?"

@BereanHouse @jacksonfrandsen @Latterdaytruth The point is that God didn't create his body from nothing, nor Adam, Eve or that wine.

@Gunstar_One @jacksonfrandsen @Latterdaytruth Are you your body only?

@ldsfilmguy Back in the 90's before this was standard my Bishop had a small speaker playing church music outside his door.

My church building has two speakers above the stake offices that constantly play white noise. I've never seen this before.

@DeadBug15 I've been in my current ward for 20 years and I love it. So many great people, strong in the faith, knowledgeable, faithful. We have people who move out of town and later move back. They make of point of getting a home in our Ward's boundaries when they return.

I’ve lived in my current ward for 6.5 years and feel like I wouldn’t miss it if I moved away tomorrow. I participate in the activities we have, and I’m active in my calling, but do others (esp men) feel this same way? Almost zero emotional connection to the ward?

@jacksonfrandsen @BereanHouse @Latterdaytruth God created Adam from the dust of the earth, Eve from his rib, he turned water into wine, and had Mary gestate a body for him for 9 months. If he created the universe from nothing, why didn't he do that for creating Adam, Eve, wine, and his own body?

You’re not actually arguing from the biblical text alone. You’re importing a very specific metaphysical framework, whether you realize it or not. For example the idea that: - God exists in a timeless, immaterial “eternity” - Absolute nothingness is a meaningful ontological category - Creation must therefore be from nothing to preserve God’s uniqueness …does not come from the Hebrew Bible. It comes from Greek metaphysics, especially: - Parmenides → “nothing” cannot exist or be a source - Plato / Middle Platonism → hierarchy of being (unchanging, immaterial = higher) - Neoplatonism → ultimate reality must be absolutely simple, beyond all composition Early Christians (as shown with Justin, Athenagoras, etc.) initially read Genesis more straightforwardly: - God orders, forms, and brings into being a cosmos - Not necessarily from absolute non-being The hebrews were even more straightforward in their reading. “If God creates like we do, it lowers Him” only follows if you accept a Greek premise: “The more unlike creation, the more divine.” But biblically, the pattern is the opposite: “The more capable, relational, and generative the more divine.” Genesis 1 actually grounds human creativity in God: - God organizes → humans organize - God forms → humans form - God speaks → humans speak - God creates life → humans participate in creation (procreation, cultivation) That’s not lowering God. That’s establishing Him as the archetype of all real agency. The later insistence on creatio ex nihilo is largely a philosophical safeguard, not an explicit biblical category. You’re actually closer to a form-based view than you think. “Let there be light” Light in scripture is not just physics—it’s order, intelligibility, and manifestation. And interestingly: Modern cosmology: - Energy → matter (E=mc²) Biblical cosmology: - Word → light → ordered world That’s not “creation from nothing” language. That’s transformation, structuring, and manifestation.

Speaking face to face like someone speaking with their friend includes seeing. I already addressed v20. Can you answer the question: Do you believe God is too powerless to show himself to someone and preserve their life as he does so? It sounds like that is exactly what you believe.

@Gunstar_One @TruthJourneySW Speaking isn’t the same thing as seeing. Can you tell me what 9 verses later says? In verse 20

Doesn’t seem that God wanted Moses or the Israelites to see his form. Didn’t want them to make a statue of Him. Why would God now be fine with Joseph Smith seeing him? And the LDS church to have a graven image of Him? ““Diligently watch yourselves — because you did not see any form on the day the Lord spoke to you out of the fire at Horeb — so you don’t act corruptly and make an idol for yourselves in the shape of any figure: a male or female form,” Deuteronomy 4:15-16 CSB

@TruthJourneySW @Jake_7777_ @macabaret_17 @oliverburdick Acts 7:55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up steadfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God Sounds exactly like what Joseph Smith saw.

It was IMPOSSIBLE for Joseph Smith to have seen GOD The FATHER and JESUS CHRIST as 2 separate personages, this is why... 📜"No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him." John1:18   📜"God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth." John4:24  📜"For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one." 1John5:7 📜"And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth." John1:14 GOD The FATHER does NOT have a physical body, but GOD as the SON does.   I heard this example, that has helped me understand the triune God, 3 in one.   Since we were created in the image of God... We each have a body, a soul and a spirit, 3 in one 📜Speaking of JESUS CHRIST: "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation." Colossians1:15 .. The key word being "INVISIBLE".   It wasn't until I left the LDS church and the One and Only GOD opened my eyes to this truth.  Proving to me Joseph Smith LIED! JESUS warned this would happen in the last days: "Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many" Matt.24:11 and "Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons" 1 Timothy4:1 "And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works." 2 Corinthians11:14-15 Joseph Smith was overcome by darkness and Satan gave him a different gospel and doctrines of demons, deceiving many! NOT a restored gospel as the LDS church claims.  If it was restored it would have matched the ORIGINAL Gospel, The Bible and it does NOT!   Account of the first vision👇🏼 rsc.byu.edu/joseph-smith-h… Great Contradictions, of The Book of Mormon, The Bible and other inspired Mormon Writings, side by side👇🏼 bible.ca/mor-contradict… The Mormon Religion and Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is an ABOMINATION!  JESUS CHRIST Himself said..."Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy. “For there is nothing covered that will not be revealed, nor hidden that will not be known. “Therefore whatever you have spoken in the dark will be heard in the light, and what you have spoken in the ear in inner rooms will be proclaimed on the housetops." Luke12:1-3

Satan is the author of: - The Quran - The Talmud - The Book of Mormon God is the author of: - The Bible

@TruthJourneySW @Salt_n_Smoke "And the LORD spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend" You literally can't make it any more direct and clear than that. Do you really think God is too powerless to actually speak face to face with a man and preserve his life while doing so?

That does NOT cancel what @Salt_n_Smoke said. Read a few verses down. GOD Was talking to Moses as a friend. Man in his sinful flesh, CANNOT see The Holy Holy Holy face of GOD ALMIGHTY in All HIS Glory and live, as Moses wanted to see. JESUS in HIS mercy protected Moses in the cleft of the rock and allowed him to see HIS back. 📜"And the LORD said, Behold, there is a place by me, and thou shalt stand upon a rock: And it shall come to pass, while my glory passeth by, that I will put thee in a clift of the rock, and will cover thee with my hand while I pass by: And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my back parts: but my face shall not be seen." Exodus33:21-23 KJV

'As a man speaketh unto his friend" cancels you your assertion. It was a literal face to face conversation. As for v20, man, by himself, without divine protection, cannot withstand the glory of God, but do you think that God is so weak that he can't show himself to a man and preserve his life? You've also got Gen32:30 and Deut 34:10.

Before people post Exodus 33:11 know this -*God and Moses speaking face to face means they spoke directly. Then go read verse 20 where God says No man can see His face and live. Numbers 12:8 is how God and Moses spoke. Clearly, not in riddles, they spoke directly and openly.

God commanded Nephi to do it, that trumps everything. Our lives belong to Him and he is within his right to command such things. It was within God's right to command the armies of Israel to wipe out every man, woman, child and beast of a village. Same as it was God's right to send a flood to kill everyone but 8 people. God chooses how and when each one of the dies.

Nephi carefully presented the circumstances of his actions: * I wasn't planning to kill him * He had robbed me * He had tried to kill me and my family and would further pursue us * I stumbled across him, I didn't lie in wait * The Lord delivered him into my hands * I didn't want to do it, and I didn't rush the decision * I never said anything inaccurate to Zoram * etc This is all to show he was justified under the Mosaic Law. But to steel man the case, let's pretend it was illegal under the Mosaic Law. That means God conceivably could authorize me to break His law like Nephi, right? Well, remember, Nephi was fulfilling a prophetic mandate under the direct delegated authority of the operating Prophet. He was following proper priesthood channels. And he didn't just receive a subjective spiritual impression-- he was visited by an angel of God in the presence of three witnesses saying Laban would be delivered into his hands. So, yes, if you are: * Completely justified by the law, or at least in the gray zone * AND currently operating with prophetic authority * AND an objective revelation to proceed is received by you and multiple witnesses Then sure, feel free to use the example of Nephi. But exactly zero of the people using the "But Nephi killed Laban" excuse meet any of those criteria.

@TracerBuIlet I do it once week, on Sundays. I type much faster than I write, so I do it in Word (plus that makes it searchable). It's like writing a letter to someone else catching them up on the week. I have my calendar remind me to do it.

Does anyone have a good experience or routine for journaling?

@rccostner Not fully baked is a plus. When my mom made cookies I would watch for opportunities to steal a spoonful of batter to eat raw.

The LDS obsession with crumbl is so confusing to me The cookies aren’t even good, there’s way too much frosting, and they’re rarely fully baked Someone please explain to me why you like crumbl

Whoops, went by memory and got that bit wrong, my bad. CS Lewis only married once. But William Clark (of the Lewis and Clark Expedition) married a teenager and that is likely where I crossed wires in my head. Bach is other example. Loretta Lynn was married at 15, and that was back in the late 1940's so not that long ago. Nobody got on their case about it back then, times were different and 100+ years ago if you were capable of reproduction society considered you old enough to get married.

@Gunstar_One @joshnaa2gez @grok did CS Lewis marry a teenager?

“Early Mormon men married teenage girls way younger than them! And just because that was socially acceptable back then doesn’t make it right!” Really? Imagine living in a time when there was no modern medicine, and death during childbirth was terribly common… Now, can you imagine wanting to have children when you’re young and healthy? Or, imagine living in a time where conditions were harsh, safety nets were nonexistent, and you were always one misfortune away from absolute poverty, starvation and homelessness… Now, can you imagine wanting to marry a man who is older and has had time to develop skills and resources to take care of you? Or, imagine living in a time when average life expectancy was 35… Now, can you imagine having kids while you’re young to reduce their risk of becoming orphans? Or, imagine you lived in a time when families tended to stay close to support one another and communities were tight-knit and centered around supporting mothers and children… Now, can you imagine how the prospect of having children while young wouldn’t feel quite as daunting as it does now? So yes, in modern society, it’s different. And we understand a lot more about mental maturity now than we did back then. Though many now put it off way too long, I’m glad we have the luxury of delaying procreation for a few years until we are mentally mature enough. Our bodies evolved to be ready to make babies when we’re teenagers. Modern society makes it safe to delay for a bit. But that does not make modern people good and past generations bad. We have the luxury of our beliefs because they built a society that gave us that luxury.

Another serious question for Creedal Christians. If God made everything from nothing (creation ex-nihilo), then why did he make Adam from the dust of the earth, and use one of Adam's ribs to make Eve. Why not just create them from nothing the same way? Why did Christ turn water into wine rather than just create wine from nothing? Why make Mary go through 9 months of pregnancy to gestate a body for him and then grow up as a child rather than just pop up with an adult body created from nothing?

@Latterdaytruth A proxy sealing doesn't mean anything without the consent of all involved, so this is just a matter of keeping all the options open. In the end she will only have one eternal companion.

Fascinating section of the handbook on the sealing of deceased women to men to whom they were legally married.

@BradWitbeck He told the Nephites he had other sheep too. I'm guessing he went on tour to visit all the lost tribes.

Jesus Christ said he had "other sheep." Imagine for a second you got access to a record of those other sheep. How would you approach it?

@Latterdaytruth One of the 3 Nephites will give a talk, or John the Revelator.

General Conference is coming soon. I need your most UNHINGED predictions 👀 👇

@Latterdaytruth We get a heads up that Christ will return in 5 years, like what Samuel the Lamanite did.

@KintsugiJin Summarize briefly what the lesson chapters/talk cover and have 4 or 5 relevant, thought provoking questions to toss out to them for discussion. It gets them talking back and forth and soon the time is over.

How do you offer a lesson in elders quorum / relief society without coming across as preachy? What works for you? Whenever I give a lesson (which has been only twice before) I always feel like the group is annoyed and disconnected. What strategies work for you to have an engaged meeting that bears fruit from the discussion?