MD

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF If I KNEW with 100% certainty that someone was going to use my car and then run over innocent pedestrians and I allowed them do it then yes, I would bare responsibility for that, absolutely. How would I not?

That’s not an answer, that’s just repeating the claim, worded differently. God just does it. That’s the point, you don’t have an explanation, you’re just borrowing mine (transformed people) while at the same time rejecting it. And No, moral evil isn’t something God “created,” it’s what happens when free creatures misuse the good He made, He allows it, but He’s not the author of it. If someone misuses something good you gave them, like a car, and they chose to run over innocent pedestrians, does that make you the creator of their bad choice?

If God can stop the Devil but won't, and everything is God's plan, then God's plan includes evil. That makes God the Devil.

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF You said "God allows evil for now to bring about a greater good" That would mean he is specifically using evil as a tool on us. Which would mean that he intended for evil to be used in this way, which would mean that God created evil.

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF However God makes it work in heaven, that's how. Your third option is still "God is fine with evil." In that case evil is a tool used by God, in which case evil would have been specifically created by God for that purpose, right?

That’s a completely false dilemma, you’re assuming the only options are “God doesn’t exist” or “God is fine with evil,” but there’s a third, God allows evil for now to bring about a greater good, like real freedom, love, and justice. You say you don’t "want" a robot world, so explain how you can have real free will and at the same time guarantee no evil, since the moment choices are truly free, choosing wrong becomes possible.

@Rapt0r911 @Danish_SMF Okay but like....that doesn't make sense does it? On one hand, the Devil is the ultimate evil and ultimate enemy that must be destroyed in the end of days, on the other hand God gave him this domain over us? the math isn't adding up here.

@DavisMC @Danish_SMF I'm sure there are reasons, Lucifer wanted to take on the headaches, perhaps God gave him the ability to exercise those lessons outside of his own Direct domain of heaven.

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF I don't "want" that but it would obviously be better to have no free will and also have never had evil or suffering ever. What I want is God to never had created (or permitted the existence of) evil in the first place. So either he doesn't exist or he's cool with evil existing.

@DavisMC @Danish_SMF What are you talking about? I asked If stopping all evil means stopping all free will, would you still want that world? You answered I feel like the obvious choice is yes? So you're the one who wants a world full of programmable robots.

@Rapt0r911 @Danish_SMF Why did God make this the Devil's domain? seems like a bad idea.

@Danish_SMF God made it clear that this is the Devils domain, the Devil operates here, God can as well, however Free will over reigns his attempts to help! God will come back and well, the Earth will be bathed with Fire! Better hope you're picked up before then, good luck!

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF "If stopping all evil means stopping all free will, would you still want that world?" this is literally what you said. how am I gaslighting you, exactly? If God can allow free will in Heaven, and still have no evil in Heaven, then he could have done so on Earth, right?

Wait, I’m the one trying to keep free will, and you’re the one saying “yeah, get rid of it” but somehow that’s my view? That’s, some impressive gaslighting. I’m saying evil is defeated by changing people, not deleting their ability to choose. Where did I get my info? From the Christian worldview, Scripture shows people in heaven still thinking, choosing, worshiping, and loving, which all require free will. If they’re still thinking, choosing, and loving in heaven, what reason do you have to say they’ve lost free will?

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF You're the one suggesting that the only way to eliminate evil is to eliminate free will. I'm saying that it would absolutely be worth it. How did he get it to work in Heaven and yet not on Earth? Where did you get your information on how much free will is in Heaven?

Heaven isn’t your diabolical robot world, people still have free will, they’re healed so they want good, so choosing good is real, not forced. Freedom isn’t the ability to do evil, it’s the ability to choose good without being enslaved to sin. God doesn’t remove free will in heaven, He restores people so they freely choose good because they genuinely want it. If people in heaven are still freely choosing good, how is that the same as a your robot world where no one has any choice at all?

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF They don't lose all meaning at all, that's absurd. no more child rape, no more murders, no more torture? huge wins. no one would EVER get tortured or raped or abused. Is there not no evil in Heaven? does all of the good in Heaven lose all meaning, because evil isn't there?

@DavisMC @Danish_SMF If no one has any choice, then “good,” “evil,” and even “suffering” lose all meaning, you didn’t solve evil, you deleted the whole moral game. If nothing is bad anymore, just programmed reactions, what exactly did you fix besides turning people into machines?

@AthletesInSpace "that's the reason he's successful and you don't" what?? ??

Lmao. What is he “working” on??

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF what does it matter who is enjoying it? is your personal enjoyment more important to you than eliminating ALL suffering?? yes of course I would rather be a programmed robot with no choices if it meant there were NO pain, NO evil? easiest choice in the world.

If you remove free will to stop evil, you also remove the ability to love, choose good, or be morally responsible, so you don’t get a better world, just a controlled one. So you’d rather be a programmed robot with no real choices if it means less pain. If there's no free will, who is actually enjoying that “better” world?

@ZaphenathJoZeph @Danish_SMF Why isn't it the devil's time yet?

@Danish_SMF Do you even know why it ain't the devil's time yet or you just plan on sounding stupid?

@brianhrc1 @Danish_SMF I feel like the obvious choice is yes? no more evil for the rest of forever and no one ever goes to hell? why WOULDN'T you choose that world?

@Danish_SMF God allowing evil doesn’t make Him evil, it means He permits free choices so real love and justice can exist, and He’ll judge evil in the end. If stopping all evil means stopping all free will, would you still want that world?

@jo28bro @Danish_SMF You suggest to take everything in the Bible literally?

@Danish_SMF Your problem is that you apparently don't have a clue of God's plan. In order to find out about God's plan you need to study the Bible from cover to cover and literally. The Book of Enoch can give added information.

@Bluextra274774 @Danish_SMF why is the devil ruling the world?

@Danish_SMF If I was god I wouldn't be fixing things if the devil is the one temporarily ruling the world

If a perfect designer built us, why do we have a blind spot, a choking hazard every time we swallow, a tailbone with no tail, wisdom teeth that don't fit, and a birth canal that kills women and babies? Why does the giraffe have a 15‑foot nerve detour for a 1‑inch job? 2

@scudog65 @PraetorPrimus @AtheistTakes Even if someone were to believe those things, how does it take more faith than your faith in God?

@PraetorPrimus @AtheistTakes Believing that the Universe created itself, for example, and that everything is just the result of random chemical processes by chemicals that first created themselves?

Atheism is not a belief!

@Pandeism @Danish_SMF I guess if we're just talking definitionally then sure, that's reasonable to me

@DavisMC @Danish_SMF I'd think it follows that being a Creator is a necessary attribute of any entity which is, in fact, a Creator. Irrespective of whether you believe such a thing exists, if it does than being a Creator is its most important attribute, and possibly its only necessary one.

Pandeism solves the stretching problem by defining God as the universe itself, which means 'God exists' is just 'the universe exists.' That's trivially true but tells us nothing. It explains nothing, predicts nothing, and eliminates every meaningful attribute of God 2

@Pandeism @Danish_SMF to me, it follows that there was no entity that was the Creator

@DavisMC @Danish_SMF Yes, that's actually a useful direction. So, extrapolate -- if normal entities are not "a Creator" (of our Universe, of course), and there were only normal entities, then it follows that.... ?

@Pandeism @Danish_SMF What? sorry I don't know what you're getting at here. an entity whose attributes exclude being a Creator? That's just normal entities.

@DavisMC @Danish_SMF Look at the contrapositive of that -- an entity whose attributes do excludes being a Creator. In such instance, there is no Creation, nothing exists. All other attributes are guesses, but a Creator must be a thing-which-creates for Creation to be, even if that's all it does.

@suchnerve wait what? how?

Yes, neurodivergence makes you poop weird. Yes, neurodivergence makes your tummy hurt. Sorry

Neurodivergent people go through things gastrointestinally that would violate the Geneva Conventions if inflicted on prisoners