Vishnu

@globalsitizn @labstamil That is your hypothesis, not evidence. Later texts can also preserve older traditions, but they can also introduce new theological developments.Has happened in multiple cultures. Eg how greek ,roman ,Egyptian,celtic,anatolian, sumerian ,persian ,syrian gods got syncretised

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil This is classic confirmation bias. The early sangam literature could have very well said that Seyyon was born here. The fact that it was shown in later sangam means that as the world became wider and communications improved, they found the origin of their leader and documented!

Nakkeerar. Avvaiyaar. Kachiyappa Shivacharyar. Arunagirinadhar. Siddhar Bogar. Pamban Swamigal. Devaraya Swamigal. Kirubandha Vaariyar. So you're telling me that all these saints, mystics and devout poets over a period of 20 centuries missed the real identity of Murugan and it finally took a Seeman, Arivumathi and Paarisalan to see the truth about Murugar? Huh? If you had a single Muruga Bhakti cell functioning in your body, you wouldn't be desacralizing a God who's so dear to our land just for your petty politics.

@globalsitizn @labstamil For your information, i did an internship there🙏🫠

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil Read Tholkappiyam. And check with YouTube videos from other historians of what was hidden in those excavations and what was brought to public!

@globalsitizn @labstamil Even mauryans didnt come far south , we are speaking about the time long ago mauryans , there is no south based mahajanapadas map. South was mostly unexplored. And i quoted that age cuz someone to become a god it takes sufficient time

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil Why not?. Population was less, and migration was still going on. It’s very well plausible for someone to travel from north to south and became a leader. And btw that 3000-4000 yrs is again an exaggeration!

@labstamil My point is just that a merger and syncretism happened at some point of time. I don’t accept the radicals of both sides , i just view it like a historian . As you mentioned varunan , he is first mentioned in mithani inscription in Turkey dated to 1380 bce ? So is he vedic god?

"She gives complete literary evidence", nothing of the sort, we are all working with same material. She mentions Tolkaapiyam with Seyon of Kurinji, which nobody denies. Same Tolkappiyam also says வருணன் மேய பெரு மணல் உலகமும், with Varunan as Lord of Neithal. So Varunar is also Tamil God now? Blatant cherrypicking to build narratives. Nobody denies the non-vegetarian offerings to Murugar by tribes, as mentioned in Thirumurugaatrupadai. Btw, not sure if you checked my thread/substack on countering Arivumathi's book which is the entire basis of this debate. Arivumathi says Murugan is warlord of Neithal, which has ZERO literary backing. He also calls him a mortal warlord king of Lemuria continent, and mentions him as son of Kotravai, without mentioning father name. Kotravai herself has exact descriptions as that of Durga and she is called as consort of Shiva by tribe folks in Vettuva veri of Silapadhigaaram. Absolutely dishonest argument with prejudice.

@globalsitizn @labstamil And early Tamil society wasnt into vedic religious belief as per the archaeological findings from adichanallur, keeladi , porunai etc

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil Early sangam literature has no evidence of specific Murugan worship or his origin!

@globalsitizn @labstamil I would rather use the terminology they were more into belief system , thus unaware of their earliest origins ie they didnt actually care where it came from. And you can find them localising vedic beliefs and traditions suitable for the Tamil culture and community

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil These are not blind rants. She is also selectively using the lines that would give more viewership for the Tamil audience. Btw, it’s the NTK and Pari Ilk who say nakkerar, Arunagirinathar, avvaiyar are all influenced by “Aryan”!

@globalsitizn @labstamil Doesn’t make actual sense 3000-4000 years ago. Pragmatical fallacy. Leader of kurinji hills cannot be an outsider who doesn’t know anything about its topography demography and way of life there. And 3000-4000 years ago hill people were too isolated

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil All the Tamil Literature says he was the Leader of Kurinji. Not the one who was born there. Why can’t a person born in one place become a leader in another place? Present day there are many examples

@globalsitizn @labstamil While we try to go long back in chronology to identify the origin of tamil paganism , research in saiva literature does only little help . Its more of an analysis and observation rather than having a belief system on a faith.

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil And the silver YouTube button behind her clearly shows she is a content creator. Whereas Madusudanan Kalaiselvan is a researcher is Saiva literature. Guess who got tricked by the Lady Pari.

@globalsitizn @labstamil That is precisely what historians describe as syncretism ,not proof that one tradition erased or invalidated the other.🤷🏾

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil She talks about Velan veriyattam but conveniently forgets that Vedic ritualistic worship was also performed parallel

@globalsitizn @labstamil These tweets conflate coexistence with origin. Yes, Sangam Tamilakam had Brahmins performing Vedic rituals, and yes, later Sangam works like Thirumurugatrupadai and paripadal already identify Murugan with Shiva’s son.

@News18TamilNadu Yov 2017 video vah ippo podre 🤦‍♂️ 9 varusham coma la irundhiya?

@CinephilePsycho @letscinema Was shown at a Special press event in mumbai a few days ago

@letscinema But how? The film releases on the 17th!

Our full review at Nolan’s new masterpiece ‘The Odyssey’ will be out tomorrow at 9.00AM PT/9.30PM IST.

@DravidaBharat @labstamil Atleast i have the guts to keep my own name , spineless fake ids shouldn’t speak about my username😂. Cry more bot😂😭😭 want some tissues?

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil @decidedpenalty7 with username called Vishnu. Ricebags are better with the name Jesus...lol

@DravidaBharat @labstamil You are the ones who destroy this precious culture and faith with such hateful views and speech. Please grow up kid

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil Enga pare pa ore evr historian...lol Dai so called historian, go find details about your Desert Cult CEO from 6th century and publish the same. They would bury you alive in Desert Sand. Which you guys deserve.

@DravidaBharat @labstamil If you want to debate please do ,dont use unparliamentary language that shows your character. Dont rant like a child

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil What you are saying is true if you are trying to find more details about your great grand father whose name is Murugan. Hello here we are referring to God Muruga. You chaps have no reverence for God Muruga, just trying to insult Hindu Faith. Damn third rate Parasites!

@RaghuBhaskaran @labstamil Exactly as you said , for eg even early vedas and upanishads don’t establish shiva as a supreme deity(i meant shiva not rudra) and rudra was know to be a storm and disease deity as per Rig Veda, but today he is a supreme god . While agni got de promoted. Thats how syncretism work

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil Oh I don't claim Bhakthi literature should be objective. As to Urais, they like history, carry the authors own biases Most Gods were worshipped via multiple methods in parallel. Ofc some fade, some get popular, it is not some "conspiracy", but simply trends of time

@globalsitizn @labstamil Tholkappiyam,porulathikaram, Akattinaiyiyal- 5 ,thirumurugatrupadai full and paripadal 5, 8, 9, 14, 19, and 21;agananooru 59, 70, 98, 149, 158, 266, 272, kurunthogai 1, 53, 82, 147, 225, 263, nattrinai 34, 47, 82, 225, 273, and Kurinji section of ainkurunooru

@decidedpenalty7 @labstamil Who is she? Anyone can create a content like this by scrambling things! Pari gives a better story than her! Visual media is powerful to trick you! So, instead of bringing such videos, bring print media evidence from Tamil scriptures