The Golan Gardener ⚔️

@real_artisan @baum_p It’s just not true though. We’ve had a national identity for a very very long time and there is a great deal of primary source documentation to back it up

@olddustyfuton @baum_p Jewish national identity and Palestinian national identity rose together at cross purpose in the late 19th century. Iron Wall Zionism is anathema to classical Judaism as Jihadist Rejectionism is anathema to classical Islam.

Question I am currently researching the History of the indigenous Palestinians for an Islamic publication, Weekly Blitz. Despite hundreds of hours of boringly, disciplined research I can find no evidence of any contact , negotiations, conflicts, wars or battles between the indigenous Palestinian leaders and those leaders who came and participated in the Babylonian , Persian, Greek or Roman invasions . Furthermore there is no archaeological evidence of any indigenous Palestinian social nor economic culture , unique Palestinian names , nor currency , no diarised written or recorded evidence , transcripts, monuments, cemeteries, religious practices , examples of political or military leaders or existence of a people , race , ethnicity, nation or tribe as the Palestinians. Can someone assist otherwise we will only be able to confirm and conclude that the so called narrative of the Palestinians being indigenous is a myth

@real_artisan @baum_p It’s not an ethnicity it’s a national identity. National identity has existed for a long time. The Palestinian national identity simply has not existed for a long time. All that it takes to be Palestinian is to identify as such

That's correct. It is nation states that are relatively new, arising from medieval hegemonic church/state fiefdoms. Cherokee nation is actually not really accurate because what is called the Cherokee nation today is really a confederation of tribes that are not necessarily directly related to each other by blood.

@real_artisan @baum_p Except that most groups or tribes dating back forever knew who they were and had unique cultures, beliefs, cuisine and identity and generally a name to call themselves. By national identity I don’t mean country. I mean like “the Cherokee nation”. National identity is not that new

@olddustyfuton @baum_p National identity is really a rather new idea and it does not negate the presence or culture of the truly indigenous Palestinians.

@real_artisan @baum_p No national identity= they were not Palestinian = there was no Palestine until the Roman’s renamed it that to spite the Jews.

Peter, I respect the consistency in your challenge — you’re asking for concrete, named evidence of a distinct “Palestinian” leadership, language, self-designation, prayers, and festivals predating the modern era. The problem is that you’re applying a modern nation-state standard to an ancient Levantine population that lived under successive empires for millennia. The same test would erase the historical reality of most pre-modern peoples in the region: Canaanites had city-states but no single “Canaanite” king or coinage; Phoenicians had powerful independent cities but no unified “Phoenician” national identity until much later. The archaeological and genetic record shows continuous Levantine population presence — the same soil, same Bronze/Iron Age ancestry that both modern Palestinians and Jews carry. That continuity doesn’t require a labeled “Palestinian” kingdom or temple inscriptions to be real. It’s the lived presence of the people, not the branding on their monuments, that constitutes indigeneity. DNA isn’t “vague” here; multiple peer-reviewed studies (including 2020 Cell and later qpAdm modeling) place modern Palestinians at 80–93 % local Levantine continuity with minimal Arabian influx. The language was Aramaic , which was replaced by Arabic gradually , but the Arabic people did not replace the native Palestinians, just their tongue, which persists today in some areas. That’s not mythology — it’s data. I’m happy to discuss specific evidence, but the demand for a pre-modern “Palestinian” national identity with kings and festivals is a category error. The people were there. The empire labels changed around them.

@_ZachFoster @nytimes Shiite isn’t an ethnicity

Israeli authorities confess they are singling out the Shi'ite Lebanese population for destruction. This is textbook ethnic cleansing, described as "Israel's message" by the @nytimes.

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Aka military age males

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft When they throw rocks at us. Also these children are usually like 14-17

Ben Gvir is posting videos showing off the execution chamber where he will exterminate thousands of Palestinian hostages. Imagine if Hitler broadcast videos of his gas chambers to gloat like this.

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft You basically hit me with the equivalent of “nuh uh” because you can’t refute my point

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Brother. You don’t know what you’re talking about

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft No I don’t. Criticism is important. I’m critical. You don’t really know what I think. And as someone who did not grow up here that faced a lot of antisemitism I definitely have a better idea of it than you haha

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft You think antisemitism includes criticism of the apartheid state known as Israel. You don’t get to act like you know what antisemitism is

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft To clarify, we conduct very important counterterrorism operations in the West Bank and that needs to be ongoing. But I unequivocally condemn settler violence and all those lunatics should be arrested, tried, and imprisoned

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Lmao don’t pretend that you think Israel doesnt treat Gaza and the West Bank as part of its territory

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft I don’t think you know what antisemitic means. Older polls are at around 95% newer ones more like 90. Either way the incredibly vast majority of Jews are Zionists. So someone not hating Jews just hating the vast majority of Jews still definitely says something

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Assuming 95% of Jews are Zionist, especially now, is what’s antisemitic

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Also land taken for security reasons as direct result of enemy military action is not expansionism

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft “Technically” is doing a ton of heavy lifting and you know it

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Yeah hating 95% of Jews except for the 5% you agree with is antisemitic. But that is a different statement.

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft “I didn’t say hating Zionists means you’re antisemitic, I said it means you hate most Jews. Yes, I’m fully aware that antisemitism means the same thing, I’m just trying to be clever” Brother. Just say what you believe. No one wants to hear this mealy mouthed bullshit.

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Technically we have almost the exact same borders as we did in the 60s pre ‘67. We never annexed Judea and Samaria. The one difference is the golan heights which was taken after we were attacked. And we gave back the Sinai for peace. If we were expansionist we would have kept it

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft If Israel wasn’t expansionist they would have the same borders that they did in the 1960s. Is that th case?

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft I didn’t say that antizionism is antisemitism I said that most Jews are Zionist so hating all Zionists directly equals hating most Jews. Do with that what you will

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Claiming 95% of Jews (dubious at best btw lol) are Zionist, therefore being antizionist is antisemitic is conflating Judaism with Zionism. You’re the antisemite in this equation brother

@Magilligan5349 @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft And you’re probably right that most Zionists are not Jews because there are like 16 million of us globally and way more people than that who support us in having a sovereign country. Which by the way is just further proof that we’re not expansionist. Never have been.

@olddustyfuton @Zukosdriver2 @drinkmoregravy @PushDemsLeft Conflating Zionism with Judaism is antisemitic. Most Zionists are not even Jewish, which is what makes this whole thing ridiculous

Average interaction with a fan of the sequel trilogy