skysagi / Video Editor
198 posts

skysagi / Video Editor
@skysagi
VTuber Editor. Long-form editor for @pikatl and @amari_TEB AKA Editor-chan, E-chan Reach out: https://t.co/6r5K602b5A
Katılım Haziran 2014
953 Takip Edilen318 Takipçiler
skysagi / Video Editor retweetledi
skysagi / Video Editor retweetledi

"Closed eyes won't take me anywhere"
.45 PARABELLUM BLOODHOUND - 2nd Trailer
Wishlist now on Steam
#45pb
English

@RAINAplease "I don't feel equipped to give my two cents on this"
*gives my two cents on this*
gotta love how I work sometimes
English

Yes to all of this! Good marketing and presentation (through personality) is essentially what amplifies the pull, once the foundation of competence is there - the personality is a multiplier. (It's the reason why people will still work with with competent assholes, but would rather collab with competent sweethearts.)
"Competence Juggernauts" is a great term btw and I'm TOTALLY stealing that. IMO, they exist in the male-presenting vtuber space, but tend to pursue narrower niches rather than going for breadth. I'm biased, but my Cari is my go-to example: he writes, draws, art directs, mentors, and somehow knows a LOT about weird history facts. (He just doesn't always choose to entertain.)
Some of the corpo and bigger indie guys with hands in multiple avenues of creative production are probably competence juggernauts in of themselves, but they're harder to point to - partly because the male space is smaller, and competence there doesn't always get the same visibility amplification.
And no short answer on the confidence building question, unfortunately. Discovering yourself, and building competence (which leads to confidence) has always been messy - you try things, outgrow them, keep others, rinse and repeat. The only difference now is that we do it publicly, with a sometimes-hostile peanut gallery from around the world watching (+ sometimes donating to the cause.) The process hasn't changed, but the audience for the process has.
English

Everyone's got a theory/"hot take" on what makes male VTubers actually land with female audiences. The lists going around look something like:
- "fanservice is key: abs, maid outfits, yaoi. girls love that shit. have you SEEN fujo spending?"
- "guys who tell self-deprecating jokes and laugh a lot are hot, great personality sells"
- "I like it when a guy actually appreciates chat and tells them he loves them"
- "duh, it's BFE. female fans who watch male VTubers are lonely AF."
And they're not wrong, exactly - but they're describing symptoms, not causes.
What those things signal in a male VTuber (when they actually work) is this:
"I'm confident enough in myself and my masculinity to do this - whether it's being shipped with the homies, cooing over cute pets, or wearing something frilly. And I'll be emotionally available to the people who actually show up for me and my work, and I'll make sure to express that freely."
That's what women are responding to - not the maid outfit, or the yaoi ship, or the spicy "that's my girl" said in a husky tone. They're actually connecting with the thing underneath that's being represented by the "fanservice bait" or "being soft" - even if they don't necessarily recognize it themselves.
Which is also why "a guy who sings, or voice acts, or is a great event host/organizer, or runs a business" lands differently in terms of appeal compared to everything else on those lists - it's proof of craft that isn't necessarily fanservice.
It signals "I work hard at something I care about deeply, and this thing can be in service to someone other than myself" in a way that grinding Apex ranked doesn't. (If you're thinking "dedicated male provider energy" - yeah, bingo.)
And women WILL eventually sniff out the guys doing it purely for "female gooner money", even if they can't always explain why they drifted away. The same attempts at yaoi fanservice, BFE, or frilly cross-dressing for these guys will feel like a cash-grab or a costume, and not an actual person.
Some people who share these "what male VTubers need to do better" lists also keep pointing at kpop and otome games like Love and Deepspace going "see, women WILL spend on male content; most male VTubers just aren't positioning themselves properly."
Yeah, not wrong - but they're two different arguments, and neither are actually being applied correctly.
Let's start with Kpop, because many people actually like to cite the rise in male (EN) Vtuber fanbases as being thanks to kpop fans/stans who "crossed over".
I've personally noticed (when reading through some translated posts on Pann) that kpop fans in 2021 were already complaining about how many of the new male rookie groups of that era all felt hollow:
- "They're singing about how 'I can hold you, girl', but they look frail AF."
- "They think constantly changing their hair color makes them the next G-Dragon, but they don't got his rap flow."
- "There's too many of them - it's hard to keep up, and everything feels like a copy of a copy. They all sound the same. Nobody stands out."
(Any of these sound familiar?)
But yeah, that was inside an industry with actual infrastructure for manufacturing this stuff...and it still didn't work, especially for many nugu (literally "who?" in Korean) groups.
Point being: many kpop agencies have the same problem - copying surface behaviors from successful groups onto their own trainees, without understanding WHY those things work. "It's also luck" is how they wave away the failures (even if luck CAN be a factor, it's not a full substitute for poor judgment and lack of effort.)
Hollywood, the wider music industry, even OG YouTubers chasing algorithm trends have all previously fallen into this trap - VTubing is just the latest entertainment industry niche to repeat the same mistake of doing purely surface reads to "analyze" what works.
LaDS and most otome games are a different beast entirely - for LaDS, the game is engineered to give you agency in the relationship. Your guy is always available on call (you choose when you want to whale for his Memories, or whether you want to engage in his route when you're bedrotting at 4am), he's always patient, and stuff is narratively structured so that you're the protagonist. He responds predictably to your inputs, and you can ALWAYS steer towards a good/happy outcome.
This sort of dynamic isn't sustainable for most VTubers to replicate wholesale - they'd have to be the human equivalent of a vending machine, with minimal/short "server maintenance" periods.
What a real person can offer that LaDS can't is the sense that he exists beyond you - that he has an inner life you didn't write, opinions that catch you off guard, or a bad day that has nothing to do with you. That's the thing that makes investment feel real rather than transactional - but only if it actually comes through.
(And before anyone brings up structural stuff, e.g. "well separating male and female vtubers is bad" - or whether male vtubers as a category is even viable or "pointless" - I'm not making that argument; I'm making an argument about the person behind the screen giving life to the character. Those are different conversations.)
No company can hand you this foundation. Plenty of them will also get in the way of you building it - typically because they'll lack staff or mentor figures who are capable at developing and showcasing your skills, never mind who you are as a person. Good intentions from a company don't guarantee competence - and most people will argue "well duh, companies aren't charities, line go up" - but that's its own post altogether.
But the guys who have this inner foundation as entertainers AND people will have built it themselves - through grit, time and a LOT of patience.
And that's the part no restructure, downsizing, or corporate decision can actually touch - and the thing that will attract and keep loyal fans for the long haul.
#RAINArambles (1/2)
English

@RAINAplease That would apply even for those who get mostly positive feedback and even succeed. I think the quote comes from BoJack Horseman that "He got famous in his twenties, so he'll be in his twenties forever." (4/4)
English

@RAINAplease Ofc, this comes from a bit of "autistic bias" since I associate being perceived with stress and unpleasant situations, but I think it applies to most that, giving others the ability to witness every step you take can easily force one into stagnation for their development (3/?)
English

@Amari_TEB You're fine, I have to have some kind of business.
English

@skysagi Sorry I'm such a bad influence :3
English

@RAINAplease I so wanna hear you talk about that *as well*. You might as well be the VTuber non-video (for now) essayist that people need the most right now
English

Bingo - it's not just performative confidence, it's no coherent self to begin with. Nothing coheres because there's nothing for it to cohere around, so the (femboy) model ends up substituting for having a self. Which is the "I am the table" problem I've written about before: VTubing is a medium, not a genre, and the model isn't a personality.
And yeah, that sits in the same category as some half-jokey takes floating around on how "some of the cutest-looking uwu-kawaii vtubers have turned out to be the most vile people around"...which is its own brand of similar dishonesty ☕️
English

@RAINAplease I would argue there is a serious lack of commitment, not just to the character/aesthetic, but to whatever principles one would establish about themselves as content creators. I wouldn't say it's dishonest, but it also completely misses the point of being anything.
English

@RAINAplease OKAY BUT ONE THING I can say though is that, just like you described about femboy and more cutesy male avatars, it's not so simple as just *having* it.
I have searched through plenty of these, and I can almost instantly tell it's purely performative.
English





