@KennethLPearce That applies to what some people have been trying to tell you about Aquinas and ibn Sina.
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Jeremy Pierce
18.3K posts
Jeremy Pierce
@TheParableMan
Ph.D. philosophy. Syracuse Univ, Le Moyne College. Author, A Realist Metaphysics of Race. Covenant member, Missio Church. Cowardly use of insults = instablock.
Syracuse, NY 参加日 Mayıs 2011
188 フォロー中491 フォロワー
Saving this quote for an appropriate occasion: "This is so obviously ridiculous that I am at a loss for words to answer such nonsense...It would be like using a sword to cut through butter!" (Basil the Great, On the Holy Spirit, §41)
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@bumbadum14 @christopherrufo Or you could just read the books written by the people who actually experienced it? It's not as if there aren't very many of them.
But doing that would not allow you to maintain your empirically unsupportable thesis, so I guess it's not an option for you.
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@christopherrufo But tbh we can’t really even trust any modern research into the black slave condition because such of that history has been entirely fabricated post CRE.
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Imagine saying this when every single Fortune 500 company and school bragged for over 10 years about how they were reducing the % of white men in their organization
Christopher F. Rufo ⚔️@christopherrufo
I've done as much as anyone to stop anti-white discrimination in America's institutions, but you have to be brain-damaged to believe that "white men are the most oppressed group in history." This is a leftist attitude, and almost certainly a projection of personal failure, frustration, or resentment onto the Jews or the social tableau. Yes, you should absolutely fight to reduce anti-white discrimination, but if you believe "100% of your problems are external," you're being dishonest with yourself and repressing massive inferiority feelings, which almost certainly have nothing to do with the war in Iran or AIPAC or whatever you think is "holding the white man down." It's leftist thinking. A victimhood fetish. Your pioneer ancestors would laugh at you for whining that you're "the most oppressed man in history" because of Pam in HR.
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@howertonjosh @TylerLeeConway Whataboutism for the "win"
and of course it's not the own you think it is
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Yes, like every nation that’s ever existed on earth (including the Africans who captured and sold the slaves), and then they abolished slavery because they appealed to… *checks notes*…. laws and governing authories being subject to Jesus Christ.
A) this isn’t the own you think it is
B) this kind of thing worked in 2015, but not anymore
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@howertonjosh @TylerLeeConway I don't think the nation of Australia ever allowed slavery.
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@SashaGusevPosts I've found it more useful to have multiple conversations with documents that it saves from each conversation in a larger project. The conversations themselves are short, and each conversation updates the documents when it is done. Long browser pages eat up computation time.
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Anthropic needs to disable all the Chrome/browser stuff. Watching Opus 4.6 struggle to navigate down a browser page is a massive bucket of cold water on AGI hopes.
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@LateHaveILoved @CapturingChrist He's too late to be hellenized, though. The hellenistic period was long gone. He was in the Islamic world. He had some influence from some classical Greek sources and maybe a few hellenistic sources (but certainly not as many as classical). But that doesn't make him hellenized.
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@TheParableMan @CapturingChrist You're right, he was a hellenized philosopher in the arab world
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I mean, we have Aquinas.
Allah Islam Quran@AllahGreatQuran
Islam is a religion for the most intelligent people.
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@Marshwiggle119 @NeilShenvi Right, it is trained on contradictory things. Even if it did have beliefs, it couldn't have a worldview, because there is no coherence in what it is trained on.
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@TheParableMan @NeilShenvi Moreover, it is trained on all kinds of incorrect mathematical statements, errors and conspiracy theories and outright lies. On flat earth theory. And it treats those differently, in how it stores information in its weights, in how it processes information, in how it outputs.
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“AI is not an idol. Not necessarily. Done right, AI doesn’t threaten the preacher…AI — used wisely in its present form and in future uses we cannot conceive of yet — will make good and faithful preachers even better.”
desiringgod.org/messages/authe…
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@Marshwiggle119 @NeilShenvi It doesn't understand anything. It certainly doesn't understand itself to be understanding anything.
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@TheParableMan @NeilShenvi Sure, say it is just trained to say it has beliefs. But while a sufficiently intelligent AI can be trained to respond as if 1+1 = 3, it still understands itself to be understanding in a hypothetical of vastly less weight than the case where 1+1=2.
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@ceobmt @KhalilAndani Also, it wasn't their views that got them criticism. It was the very fact that they did philosophy. It was a bunch of anti-intellectuals taking any instance of thought as evil.
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@KhalilAndani And they got slandered and persecuted by the Khalifate while Aquinas is called the Common Doctor by the Magisterium
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I mean Aquinas was reading Al-Farabi and Ibn Sina…..
Capturing Christianity@CapturingChrist
I mean, we have Aquinas.
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@ceobmt @KhalilAndani There was an attempt to declare Aquinas a heretic. It didn't succeed, and the movement to get him declared a saint did. But he wasn't universally loved.
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@hitme_mmorty @KhalilAndani Learning from someone and building on their work is not plagiarism.
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@KhalilAndani I mean, Al-Farabi and Ibn Sina were plagiarizing Aristotle and Plato.
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@Nbal148 @KhalilAndani He calls him the Commentator. Ibn Sina is the Doctor, I believe. Aristotle, of course, is the Philosopher. Aquinas had nicknames for a lot of the philosophers that he respected and learned from.
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@KhalilAndani Was Aquinas reading Al-farabi and Ibn Sina or were they all reading Aristotle? Did Aquinas ever cite Al-farabi or Averoes' works?
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@LateHaveILoved @CapturingChrist Ibn Sina was not Arab. He was from Uzbekistan. He was born in Bukhara. He was Central Asian. His culture has as much influence from the Khans as it did from the Middle East.
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@CapturingChrist Avicenna and averroes were Hellenized Arabs who benefited from Grecian and western philosophy, after their era there were few Islamic scholars of note, and Aquinas thrashed them
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@Marshwiggle119 @NeilShenvi You can train an AI to respond like Kant, but that doesn't make it hard a worldview. It doesn't have any beliefs. It's just trained to sound like it does. But even apart from that, orthodox Christian writings are a part of what these LLMs are trained on.
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@Marshwiggle119 @NeilShenvi I know what you mean if you say a thermostat knows what temperature to turn on, but it's still false.
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@KennethLPearce Somehow you've attracted all the trolls. Lots of people asking to be blocked here.
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FYI: if you think Ibn Sina is not a philosopher worth taking seriously, then you think Thomas Aquinas is a terrible judge of philosophical merit.
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@gooby_scotus @KennethLPearce His presentation of the contingency argument was not surpassed in Aquinas. And ibn Sina formulated it first.
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@KennethLPearce Thomas refuted him so that we no longer must take him seriously.
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@ShaambaBaashdi @KennethLPearce He got it from Aquinas, who got it from ibn Sina.
Syracuse, NY 🇺🇸 English
@KennethLPearce Something something modernism, something something nominalism.
In my extremely minimal philosophical knowledge, I do appreciate Leibniz's cosmological argument above all the others, even if I feel uncertain about it now.
Plus, Brian May looks like him; I can't hate him.
GIF
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@Marshwiggle119 @NeilShenvi No, I have philosophical convictions that tell me that it's literally impossible, in principle, for it to have a worldview. It's not the sort of thing that can have a view, never mind a worldview. It's not about detecting or spotting it. It's like saying a rock has a worldview.
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@TheParableMan @NeilShenvi I understand you think the system can make mistakes.
And you think the system does not have an underlying worldview.
And your (presumably above average) ability to read theology and Bible outputs is such that you do not detect that underlying worldview.
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@Marshwiggle119 @NeilShenvi William James has some pretty strong arguments for not letting that keep you from believing things, even if you don't have certainty about whether they are true. We really couldn't live our lives with such a standard.
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@Marshwiggle119 @NeilShenvi Then you misunderstand me. I am well aware of the dangers of not being in a position to evaluate what AI hands to you. If you can't evaluate it, there are huge risks in terms of getting fed false information. But of course that's true of any source of information.
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