Coyote

@russellh777 @Romy_Holland Name me one thing he was wrong about

@Romy_Holland @CoyoteProjects You're arguing with a person who says Alex Jones was right about everything.

i have an old friend who’s an ardent anti-vaxxer. she’s insistent that if her kids got measles they’d develop stronger immunity than a vaccine could confer. this is, of course, wrong. in the case of measles, the disease causes immune amnesia and actually makes you newly susceptible to diseases you’d previously developed immunity to. many deaths historically happened downstream of measles infections bc of this. i’ve told this friend this information many times. she knows i’m well versed in biology, and generally believes me to me knowledgeable. but on vaccines she responds authoritatively with nonsense info she got from some instagram conspiracy theorist. i feel pretty sad and helpless about this issue. there are only so many ways you can compel people to vaccinate their kids, and they are clearly insufficient bc measles is on the rise. i wish people were more reasonable, less easily misled.

@foreverbiscoff @Calluna1007 @Romy_Holland Not at all

@CoyoteProjects @Calluna1007 @Romy_Holland I hope you're still kidding.

@suchnerve Most of them don’t look like that though.

“52% of women aged 20 to 39 in the USA are now child-free” YES!!!!!!!!!

It is more complicated than that but it isn’t non-existent. Severe immune response can cause negative outcomes. All I want is transparency in that it isn’t entirely risk-free, and everyone acts like you’re insane if you suggest that. AND the industry denies as many negative outcomes as they can for as long as they can, so we don’t get a true comparison of risks. Thanks for the emotional personal attack too, you all continually show your colors.

@CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland no, again you're equating "severe immune response" like it's one big dial that only goes up or down when it's much more complicated than that: safe controlled exposures are going to be much better than wild infections and yes, you are crazy for opting into a scam that kills kids

@foreverbiscoff @Calluna1007 @Romy_Holland Yes but as we’ve established even vaccinated kids can still get measles so my unvaccinated kids aren’t putting anyone’s “too young” babies at risk any more than any fully vaccinated child is.

@Calluna1007 @Romy_Holland @CoyoteProjects "If vaccines work, your kids are safe." --not true if your kids are babies too young to be vaccinated. An encephalitis vaccine reaction is a freakish rarity, whereas many vaccine-preventable illnesses carry high risk of encephalitis. Measles in particular.

@foreverbiscoff @Calluna1007 @Romy_Holland No I believe it is, I understand that, I was jokingly dismissing like the vaccines don’t ever have side effects people do

@CoyoteProjects @Calluna1007 @Romy_Holland Then you should read the article, as this is a well-known and well-established post-measles complication, just as shingles is known to be caused by the chicken pox virus many years later.

Indeed measles kills cells that the vaccine would not. I agree that measles is more dangerous than its vaccine. But the vaccine still induces a severe immune response. It has to in order to have any hope of working. But not every baby gets measles. Every baby (unless you opt out and are willing to be branded as crazy) gets 20+ vaccine injections within the first twelve months. All I am saying is that they are not risk-free. They can’t be. It’s a trade off calculation that parents and doctors should be able to make informed choices about together determining what is the best course of action.

@CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland if your baby caught measles, the virus would be killing off several types of important immune cells throughout the body, where the death of those cells = more inflammation signals and more spread of the measles virus to kill more cells vaccine, in contrast, kills no cells off

@Kschu11 @MdniteLibrarian @Romy_Holland That’s not the same thing at all. It doesn’t even follow the same logical flow / pattern. Address the actual claim I’m making if you can.

@CoyoteProjects @MdniteLibrarian @Romy_Holland You are using incredibly bad reasoning. If you are insulted by that being called out, go somewhere else. "I almost drowned as a child, the very same summer my parents taught me to swim. I'm not going to teach my kids to swim, it's too dangerous."

@Kschu11 @Romy_Holland Sorry I can’t dumb it down any further.

@CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland This makes everything else you've said so far seem even more absurd and confused. Can't respect it

@Kschu11 @MdniteLibrarian @Romy_Holland lol okay see you people are completely incapable of engaging at all. All personal insults and “trust the science”

@CoyoteProjects @MdniteLibrarian @Romy_Holland "probably works sometimes" is pretty much immediately disqualifying. It is your right to be willfully ignorant and obtuse but don't expect anyone else to be impressed by your (and your parents') second-grader logic

@Kschu11 @Romy_Holland Basic sanitation and vaccines. What did you think I was going to say vaccines never did anything?

@CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland How did those diseases get eradicated here?

Alex jones has literally never been wrong

@JCRich @Romy_Holland Won’t be long until there is

@CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland Look out, there's a family of illegals living under your bed.

@JCRich @Romy_Holland Have you been outside recently?

@CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland There are not 100 million illegal immigrants in this country, moron

These people are so goddamn retarded

okay, then humor me here, you’re apparently an immunologist right? In order to give long term immunity you have to have a strong enough immune response right? Naturally that looks like a 102 fever for a few hours or whatever. Artificially, the vaccines have adjuvants that increase the immune response in order to accomplish the same thing, I do not think it is entirely safe to induce a significant immune response in a baby at 0, 3, 6, 9, 12 months. It would not be good for my baby to catch measles at this age, why would it not be the same (even to a lesser degree) for vaccines?

@CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland LLM slop and lies you can look up the financials of vaccine manufacturers, vaccines are not very profitable generally nor do pediatricians get kickbacks--they provide vaccines at breakeven, at best you are not impartial, you are emotionally invested in a scam that kills kids

@JCRich @Romy_Holland Try thinking really hard and see if you can figure it out. Okay good try now I’ll explain: There are 100 million illegal immigrants in the US, largely from countries with little to no public sanitation, and they bring diseases that have been eradicated in the US. Okay 👍

@CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland 1. I have no idea where you are coming up with 100 million "third worlders".... what does that mean? 2. The implication in your comment is that unvaccinated immigrants are bringing disease to this country. But that means that vaccines work! 3. Vaccines work.

@robgoldbergo @JCRich @Romy_Holland Never said that at all.

@JCRich @CoyoteProjects @Romy_Holland no no see, it’s good when Americans aren’t vaccinated, but bad when foreigners aren’t

@foreverbiscoff @Calluna1007 @Romy_Holland No measles at birth just hepatitis in case my baby is shooting heroin. She died of measles 10 years after getting it? Doesn’t sound causal to me!

@Calluna1007 @Romy_Holland @CoyoteProjects Babies aren't vaccinated for measles at birth. The girl in the linked article caught measles as a young infant too young to be vaccinated and died 10 years later from measles-induced encephalitis.

Beyond that, between vaccine manufacturers and anti vaxxers who had the conflict of interest? I’m not making any money from not giving my kid shots. The company makes a lot of money. The pediatricians make a lot of bonus money for hitting threshold percentages of kids vaccinated / fully vaccinated. Who’s impartial here?

“Rigor the claim deserves” Science is your god and yet you don’t even worship it correctly. Here I’ll do it for you. In 1978 9 infants died after receiving a TDP vaccine from Wyeth lot #64201 (4 of them within 24 hours). They recalled that lot and others nationwide. They never proved direct causal link (because of course they didn’t, can you imagine if they did? No one would get vaccines ever again, that’d be bad for public health and more importantly, profits). However, after this incident vaccine manufacturers began splitting lots up to maximize different lot numbers being given within localities, so no one area had a concentration of one lot. This is what a “hot batch” is. If you don’t believe the shot caused those deaths or any others, fine, I get that it’s not accepted science. But if there was really no way anything would ever be wrong from the shots, or from hot batches, why would they split up batches like that after an incident tied to one batch? If there were to be something wrong with a batch, if one in a million batches had a statistically significant chance of causing adverse reactions, would they admit it? If you don’t think these companies ever do anything unethical, and they’re entirely altruistic, then I both pity and envy your view of the world.