Matthew Moore

@AggrendWoW @ScHniPPaH @wowclassicdevs My guild were quite happy we could flex in a few extra players and no one got left out. We're not asking for flex raiding or more loot buy surely letting us add a few more only benefits the casual players greatly?

@ScHniPPaH @wowclassicdevs Not sure what update you are looking for, sorry. There was a bug with it that allowed more than 20 in that we fixed. Not much else to say right now.

hey @wowclassicdevs @AggrendWoW any chance on an update about the whole 20man mc thing ? sick of playing signup roulette and benching ppl for no reason...

@Zirene @Sknilegap @jorgito_de_38 @SageStein555 Maybe you think rogues are fine but they're not. Not for the average player. It's far too hard to achieve far less than other tanks. I don't care about some future tier piece, I want to do the dungeon content... and I just can't with these tools, just my 2 cents.

@Zirene @Sknilegap @jorgito_de_38 @SageStein555 I want to be able to tank dungeons for my friends. I've been disappointed by each phase and I'm pretty close to giving up on rogue tank out of sheer despair. All tanks should be able to tank all content. There is no class fantasy in being less capable than other tanking classes.

@Zirene Hey, quick heads up. So far, rogue tanking threat is pretty rough. AoE threat is extremely hard right now. Even single target threat is pretty tight. Thinking maybe JafW may need a threat adjustment? Rogue discord seems pretty unanimous about this. 1/2

@AggrendWoW I love the idea of 2 lockouts a week, I like the idea of MC only being 1/week. I am DREADING having to farm/collect WB's and Consumes twice a week. I didn't want it P3 raid logging with time to spare. With even more of them at 60 I resent the tax on my time to be able to raid.

I just posted something on the official forums but just letting anyone who is concerned about the twice weekly lockout to know we hear ya. We are talking about it as a team and we'll have a bit more info (and ideally context) available soon. Try not to panic too much. Ultimately if this isn't something that we think will work in a satisfying way, we'll just not do it. We aren't dug in on it at all. Glad to hear the feedback. Try to keep it calm and civil, though and remember we all want the same thing; for P4 to be fun and engaging.

@DATGUYCOOP @AggrendWoW Having to gather level 60 WBs and Consumes twice a week sounds like hell but without it I do half the damage of others and if I want to tank I'll never hold threat against a buffed player. These buffs are not a choice or optional they are a tax on our time and feel bad.

@AggrendWoW Honestly I dont mind the raid lockout I mind farming all those dang world buffs I HATE it soooo much.

@TraderSumo1 @AggrendWoW @EbonhardtTV @Zirene I will third this motion. The few insights i've gleaned from his posts today and feedback given through other channels has restored my faith in the future of SoD... until the next patch notes at least ;)

Hey Aggrend, I spoke with @Zirene earlier today. I shared some thoughts/insights from the top 20 ranking warcraftlogs tanking rogues. He also gave us some insight into some of the recent PTR designs. I wanted you to know that the guy is a class act and a great addition to your team. Nothing but praises to be said about him.

Hey @AggrendWoW how many more iterations of the PTR will there be? I'm kinda hoping for a July 11th launch date for Phase 4

@Exadra @Zirene @MD9132575282835 @Wowstalker25486 @MenatwoHC @Archetype01 @AggrendWoW @KawneyEast When I first saw UA I was excited that I might be able to tank multiple mobs, maybe even a dungeon. Then I tried it and, much like Shuriken Toss, was left disappointed and relegated to single target raid boss tanking. I am praying the P4 runes let me tank trash/dungeons.

@Zirene @Matthew89944696 @MD9132575282835 @Wowstalker25486 @MenatwoHC @Archetype01 @AggrendWoW @KawneyEast To bring up UA since I didn't touch on it earlier due to it not being a change, as someone who was 100% on board on sod day 1 with the parry tank gimmick, this is the one that broke my heart the most - UA releasing and excluding parries.

Build is being updated on SoD PTR now. While you wait, have some update notes: us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/wow-c…

@Zirene @MD9132575282835 @Wowstalker25486 @MenatwoHC @sneedyoboi @Archetype01 @AggrendWoW @KawneyEast There was an expectation that Tank Rogue would have more identity than just a DPS rogue who makes more threat and their weapons would reflect that. But mutilate is too good in most cases so we're 'forced' into daggers. Does anyone even look at Main Gauche, what's it even for? :P

@MD9132575282835 @Wowstalker25486 @MenatwoHC @sneedyoboi @Archetype01 @AggrendWoW @KawneyEast Yeah. I think one of the issues is a lot of people like the Combat Rogue fantasy, and you can't really take it away at this point. Rogues would be an easier class to design if they could only use Daggers, but taking away their swords further than Mutilate has is kind of a no-no

@Zirene @Wowstalker25486 @MenatwoHC @sneedyoboi @Archetype01 @AggrendWoW @KawneyEast This is the sort of feedback that needs to be more available than a thread here. A lot of rogues, like me, have been frustrated at feeling like the forgotten no choices dead rune class. But this has helped me understand, but it's not going to get the visibility it needs here.

@Wowstalker25486 @MenatwoHC @sneedyoboi @Archetype01 @AggrendWoW @KawneyEast Thank you for coming to my BED talk, where I write posts from my bed. Even with everything I wrote, it is not exhaustive. I would ask people to refrain from WhatAboutisms, speaking/asking about unrelated topics, or trying to post "gotchas!". Be nice, don't make me tap the sign.

@AggrendWoW The warrior 'Dragonslayer lite' suggests your team know how mandatory and unfun WBs are. Even better would be to just bake WB's into the raids, put an NPC at the door WC style to rebuff us or you could remove them entirely like happened once live moved on from vanilla.

There's a few things missing from the Blackrock Eruption event at the moment. Looking at getting that turned on on PTR now but not sure if we'll be able to get it enabled before the weekend. Mostly involving some "flavor"/theming stuff and the buffs that increase or decrease honor gains inside or outside the mountain.

@AggrendWoW This feels tone deaf to rogues. Half of our runes are still abandoned wastes of space. The 'tanking runes' are being forced into mandatory overlaps and despite the SSB 'buff' we're still essentially forced to mutilate because it's just better. RIP TF dreams for rogue tanks.

@AggrendWoW @ReadyPapaOne "lets make more tanks to fill your 5 man spot if you are short" I had to do a double take on that. Rogues can't tank dungeons. There are DPS specs better for 5 man tanking. If it isn't one big target rogues can't do it and not even the new runes look like they'll change that.

I think going into SoD we thought it sounded interesting for certain things about certain tanks to be unique or for individual tanks to have drawbacks or strengths and I think in a poitential future version of classic that is a bit more grounded in # fewerchanges vanilla we might explore that design again, but I can't really see a world where we say "you can't tank this raid at all", at least not right now in SoD. One tank may be better at certain things than others (I suspect you'll still prefer a ranged/lock tank and a 2nd tank who can block on demand for twin emps, for example), but I suspect we'll tune most of the raid content at 60 to allow for pretty much any combination of tanks, especially with the smaller raid sizes. This is one of those things that looked good in the abstract, but our perception has changed a lot since we launched SoD. Our original vision for lock, shaman, and rogue tanks was "lets make more tanks to fill your 5 man spot if you are short" but seeing how enthused and invested some folks got about the new tanks, its a tough sell to say "eh sorry most of your buttons just won't work in here."

I'd like to take a minute to post and request that if you have class feedback for phase 4, go ahead and head over to the PTR forums to leave it there. Being honest, I'm a lot busier than I used to be and my twitter following is a lot larger than it used to be, and while I read every DM or tweet people send me, its not always as easy to find specific points later to link to team members (say if i happen to read tweets in the evening and am not near my work PC or something). Now more than ever I don't want good feedback to get lost in the shuffle because I'm not able to follow up on a tweet fast enough and lose track of it. We also have multiple people watching forums for this round of PTR so I think it's just a better format for this in particular. Obviously please civil even on the forums (especially on the forums!) when leaving feedback. I still love getting tweets, reading them, and replying to them (even if its not as often as I'd like), so feel free to hit me up, I just really want to make sure the feedback for phase 4 lives in a place where its easily accessible to the team. Here's the Phase 4 forum. Thank you! us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/c/in-de…

@AggrendWoW @hammerdanceLIVE Or now is the chance for some brave changes and to remove world buffs. The silent majority hate them and I'm sure it would make balancing easier too!

Yes! It was a deliberate choice to not include world buffs in these first few weeks of PTR. Once they are there, no one will test without them and getting a baseline without them would be impossible. We will add them at some point in the future once we get the data we are looking for without them and we stabilize the initial changes a bit.

@AggrendWoW If the Sword Rogue 'fix' is damage then it'll sim against Muti and rogues will pick the highest. It needs to feel different. Like have Muti be about efficient resource usage and maybe have combat be more proc/reactive and with real aoe so we can actually tank more than 1 thing.

The team focused on SoD has spent a good chunk of the last few days chewing on a rather large list of class adjustments coming soon (likely actually soon, not "soon tm" soon). As always we want to prime everyone that it's not going to fix every single thing everyone wanted, but we are continuing to iterate. We've been watching discords and forums for ideas and suggestions as we go, and while that's fine and good, I figured it might be a fun exercise to probe for a few suggestions here to a few targeted questions. Disclaimer; there may be an excellent idea in here that you love that we can't execute on for whatever reason. Game dev isn't easy and sometimes you have to pass on a good idea for a myriad of reasons. It's nothing sinister and its not us being tone deaf. Many things are also too big to hotfix so we have to think about what we do now vs. next phase. So, feel free to post suggestions or links to media with good suggestions in reply. Please do keep it civil though both towards me/the team and each other. I've been increasingly having to mute/block folks with abusive or unhelpful commentary so let's all be chill humans together. Lastly, please try and frame your suggestion with both a) the issue to be addressed, and b) your suggestion--phrased as concisely as possible. We likely won't have time to read super long posts/threads to find the meat of your point, so this will help (he says, while typing a super long post himself). Anyway, here goes: 1. Shadow DPS - We'd like to increase damage while allowing them to still shine in terms of group utility, particularly because their utility/value is likely to increase even further at 60 with some new stuff coming. One thing we also keep coming back to as well is wanting to restore mind flay to having a place in the toolkit. With that in mind, how would you suggest improving Shadow DPS with those goals in mind? 2. Survival Tree for Hunters - We know a lot of melee hunters really want Survival to be a thing and we agree that it really fits that "RPG ranger" class fantasy. Currently, BM tends to outstrip it in terms of raw output. What do you think could be interesting to zhuzh this up and make a deepish survival investment interesting? 3. Holy Paladins - We did you guys a bit dirty by not giving you interesting buttons to push like every other healing class. Viewed through a level 60 vanilla lens holy is great, but in SoD it leaves a lot to be desired. One thing we've been discussing is a group heal or some sort of proactive heal mechanic for Holy, but interested to hear some concise ideas here. 4. Sword Rogues - We have some adjustments coming in the upcoming update but we are open to ideas for how to make Saber Slash and other sword gameplay compelling. Might simply be a "do moar damage" adjustment that fixes this in the end, but we are interested in "feelsy" adjustment ideas too. 5. Warriors - Rage is a problematic mechanic because more damage = more rage = more damage = more rage ad infinitum. This is going to become more problematic at 60 as well. If we had it to do over again, we'd likely have normalized rage (i.e. you don't get extra rage when you do more damage/crit) at the start of the season and focused on major changes to their gameplay to compensate. The way it works now really hamstrings the design options for Warriors as we have to worry about the historically best dps in the game becoming even better later and forcing us to do an absolutely massive nerf which everyone would hate. To you, what would be a good trade for some form of normalized rage at 60 if we had to do such a thing? To close us out--at this point, we are always open to novel ideas for any class, including things that don't just strictly borrow from future expansions. Our philosophy on this has shifted from when we started developing this season and now we'd love to experiment with totally NEW mechanics (that ideally fit somewhat plausibly into the classic ecosystem). Not to say we won't use future expansion spells, but there's a willingness to expand our horizons a bit. Anyway sorry for the length. We've had a lot of fun just trawling discords and forums recently but figured I'd just throw this into the maelstrom and see what we get here as well. Thanks! EDIT: I am not answering questions here, so sorry if you want to ask something. My thoughts are irrelevant to this discussion and we want YOUR ideas.

@AggrendWoW SoD might just be the most wow fun I've had in a decade... but not on my rogue. Mutilate is SO good you can't not run it and since P2 all the runes are just minor DPS buffs. Nothing cool or interesting. Even the rogue tank is just the DPS rogue with a threat buff :(