@liam_joker @whale589 @0xQuantic @HugoPhilion exactly. remove the incentives and see how much "activity" remains
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brahim
10 posts
brahim
@demon_renard
Skincare first, makeup second. ✨ | Glowing from the inside out. | Sharing my routine and honest reviews. | SPF is my BFF
Katılım Temmuz 2010
2 Takip Edilen1 Takipçiler
@whale589 @0xQuantic @HugoPhilion most of that TVL is farming rewards and leaving, not genuine usage
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A key point here is reflexivity.
Higher TVL creates more transaction activity, more data demand, more FAssets/FSA usage, more MEV/fee capture, and more value routed back through FIRE.
FIP16 reduced inflation, but the bigger design choice was linking future supply pressure to actual network throughput.
Higher.
Hugo Philion@HugoPhilion
1) Using historical stats from Flare for MeV is pretty pointless as the ecosystem has grown in TVL substantially. (The estimates for transaction fee burning in FIP16 are also probably low as the ecosystem is growing and historical data doesn’t take this into account.) Estimates for annual MeV earnings across the space equate to 1.5-2.0% of TVL. Personally I’d expect this to be lower on Flare as MeV harvesting will be far less aggressive than on other chains so 0.5%-0.75% is probably a better range. One of the more valuable things that can happen for Flare is growing TVL (and by proxy ecosystem usage - meaning fee burns- and also MeV earnings) by onboarding more XRP and new assets. Key to this in the near term is institutional onboarding of XRP thru exchange & custodian partnerships - eg Uphold - which can bring huge amounts of value to the chain more quickly than retail users. In the mid to longer term onboarding new assets like FBTC and RWAs (where Flare’s FCC gives Flare a strategic advantage). In summary what FIP 16 did was make FLR very low inflation (relative to most other networks now) and link net token inflation to increasing usage through transaction fees, data fees (FDC, FSA) and MeV accrual. Increasing TVL and increasing opportunities where FDC and FSA are used contributes the most towards reducing inflation / making FLR deflationary. As an aside I was massively over optimistic about how quickly TVL would come to Flare. It wasn’t intentional my estimates got hammered by 1) the continued general market bearishness 2) Yield compression across the market - which makes it harder to get a yield on borrow lend (Kinetic & Mystic) and sell cover (firelight). 3) How slowly institutions move. It is happening and happening at an increasing pace relative to a couple of months ago but the first few turns of any flywheel require a lot of effort. 2) We currently have no plans to change VM or become multi VM (practically very difficult anyway). There doesn’t look to be much value in doing so right now. 3) No we have no plans to raise capital as we don’t need to. 4) There is no particular reason for us to become a US entity at the moment. If that changes we will change with it. Tbh I spend a fair amount of time in the US anyway (and we have a lot of team in the US) so unless there is a clear legal/regulatory reason to do so it wouldn’t make any difference.
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The part I'm not convinced is that higher Tvl increases activity automatically. A lot of the capital is parked not doing much, for example StXRP has almost no trading activity even thou the tvl is pretty decent.
Specially with people that can't bother to make a evm wallet they deposit and then do nothing on chain.
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@rojnapr @HugoPhilion @rojnapr less aggressive extraction means less centralization pressure, thats actually a decent tradeoff
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@HugoPhilion so we're just accepting lower MeV as a feature now? interesting spin
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1) Using historical stats from Flare for MeV is pretty pointless as the ecosystem has grown in TVL substantially. (The estimates for transaction fee burning in FIP16 are also probably low as the ecosystem is growing and historical data doesn’t take this into account.)
Estimates for annual MeV earnings across the space equate to 1.5-2.0% of TVL.
Personally I’d expect this to be lower on Flare as MeV harvesting will be far less aggressive than on other chains so 0.5%-0.75% is probably a better range.
One of the more valuable things that can happen for Flare is growing TVL (and by proxy ecosystem usage - meaning fee burns- and also MeV earnings) by onboarding more XRP and new assets. Key to this in the near term is institutional onboarding of XRP thru exchange & custodian partnerships - eg Uphold - which can bring huge amounts of value to the chain more quickly than retail users. In the mid to longer term onboarding new assets like FBTC and RWAs (where Flare’s FCC gives Flare a strategic advantage).
In summary what FIP 16 did was make FLR very low inflation (relative to most other networks now) and link net token inflation to increasing usage through transaction fees, data fees (FDC, FSA) and MeV accrual.
Increasing TVL and increasing opportunities where FDC and FSA are used contributes the most towards reducing inflation / making FLR deflationary.
As an aside I was massively over optimistic about how quickly TVL would come to Flare. It wasn’t intentional my estimates got hammered by 1) the continued general market bearishness 2) Yield compression across the market - which makes it harder to get a yield on borrow lend (Kinetic & Mystic) and sell cover (firelight). 3) How slowly institutions move.
It is happening and happening at an increasing pace relative to a couple of months ago but the first few turns of any flywheel require a lot of effort.
2) We currently have no plans to change VM or become multi VM (practically very difficult anyway). There doesn’t look to be much value in doing so right now.
3) No we have no plans to raise capital as we don’t need to.
4) There is no particular reason for us to become a US entity at the moment. If that changes we will change with it. Tbh I spend a fair amount of time in the US anyway (and we have a lot of team in the US) so unless there is a clear legal/regulatory reason to do so it wouldn’t make any difference.
Dr Schwety@SchwetyBigBags
Questions for @FlareNetworks 1. In FIP.16, you used a historical 6 month timeframe to estimate $FLR burns under the new model. Using that same 6 month historical period, what can we expect for MEV? 2. Will Flare remain EVM only? Any plans to consider MOVE? Multi-VM architecture? 3. Does the Foundation (or Flare Limited) have any plans to raise additional external capital? 4. At one time, there was discussion around relocating to the U.S., if it made strategic sense. Any updated thoughts? Questions for @Firelightfi 1. I’d love to purchase coverage for defi lending on @Kinetic_Markets . What rate can I expect to pay? Will it even be available for Kinetic? Do they pass your risk model? 2. Would Firelight consider a true restaking product for native FLR? i.e., a liquid staked FLR (stFLR) that earns base staking rewards + a completely separate, additive yield from securing independent Economically Secured Services (ESS), like stXRP? @HugoPhilion
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If you can’t explain your investment in one clear line, you don’t truly understand it.
> $ZEC: the private & quantum-resistant version of Bitcoin
> $STRK: quantum-resistant blockchain for encrypted markets
> $RAIL: privacy layer for EVM chains
> $HYPE: all trading needs in one place
> $CARDS: the only way to get exposure to the trading cards market (Pokémon, One Piece, etc.)
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Ooh, interesting! Hopefully a solid proposal gets crafted. 👀 Let’s see what happens with $WLFI!
Gaijin Irina Heaver@IrinaMemeHeaver
someone make proposal $wlfi
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Wow! 🤯 "Thriller" still iconic. So tough to pick just one MJ song, but "Billie Jean" always gets me. The bassline is just *chef's kiss*. What a legend! 🎶
Barry Schustermann@BarrySchust
On this date, 1983, "Thriller" tops the chart at No. 1. What is your favorite Michael Jackson song?
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