Mark Tyrkba

@marcsh @chikn113 @__alula You don't need to compile "another LLVM" since you can link it dynamically? You can look at codebases like Jai, in which people writing the actual code are insanely experienced, therefore keeping the codebase really organized and easy to maintain

@marktyrkba @chikn113 @__alula Like that terminally online Wirth guy. GenZ is Wirthless (since tone is hard in text. Imagine a flat C playing) Self hosting tickles the part of my brain that tickles parts of my brain, but yeah, its not _needed_. Usually more of a "oh good, I dont have to compile another LLVM"

github.com/vercel-labs/ze… holy shit that's very horribly architectured, because they have tightly tied executable formats to architecture specific code generation (and seemingly have it duplicated across coff/elf) and that's just literally the first thing I saw while exploring the repo

@chikn113 @__alula Sure gang

@marktyrkba @__alula aint a real lang otherwise

@chikn113 @__alula I'm not trying to defend the slop language here, but why are people that aren't compiler developers are always so excited about self-hosting the language? The ROI literally isn't worth it in some cases, or even the majority of the cases.

@__alula >"great new lang" >look inside >.c if it is so good why don't they write it in their own lang, they can't bootstrap?

@sduck378 Is there actually no way to turn those off? This is terrible

might just fork the zig compiler and add a flag to disable errors for things like unmutated variables, as that type of behaviour being forced is the only thing that turns me off zig, and it is a deal breaker pretty much

@wookash_podcast @starfreakclone Especially in such an era I mean, lol

@wookash_podcast @starfreakclone It's always good to see high quality software in such an era!

Had a great honor to chat with @starfreakclone about his FRED - friendly editor. Cameron gave me a tour of his code editor built for a special purpose - to aid in his work, which means working with often 1M loc C++ files. FRED is not only extremely responsive and works flawlessly on Debug build, but has a couple of sweet features, like a spectacular Undo/Redo tree view We start off with the FRED tour from the product perspective, and then we dive into the code, to see how it's built from the inside! @starfreakclone, thank you so much! youtube.com/watch?v=XexxO5…

@ctatedev Did you AI-generate this tweet too?

I built Zero in 3 days. I didn't expect it to compile. I didn't expect it to mostly self-host. I definitely didn't expect it to work at all. Inspired partly by Bun's rewrite to Rust, Zero started as an experiment. Honestly, the project says more about where AI is today than it does about the language itself. It took more than 3,000 agent tasks to get here, and it's still nowhere near ready for serious comparisons, benchmarks or evals. But the goal is bigger than the current result. The hope is to either create a new language with tooling designed for agents from the ground up, or take learnings and apply it back to existing languages and ecosystems. The ideas are simple: 1. Make languages (and new versions) easy for agents to learn, adapt to and fix on the fly, even when not in the training data. 2. Build a standard library comprehensive enough that most projects don't need external dependencies. 3. Create a tight, fast development loop that even small models can reliably work with. I've never wanted to create a programming language. But after repeatedly running into the same problems, safe but slow builds, fast but unsafe builds, agents struggling with new languages and version changes, wanting faster builds, smaller bundles and better DX, I started wondering: Could accelerated, agent-driven iteration produce a language and tooling stack designed around these constraints from the start? So Zero was born.

@ankkala I would rather use my own braincells and not produce slop, but what you should do is delete your account

Would you rather use programming AI as a VSCode plugin or as a standalone desktop app like Codex?

What, why? @rfleury

@izs Kind of yeah but it still depends on the context, and a local var being restricted to a few lines might not be enough. Like in this screenshot, but there I just decided to name a variable descriptively instead of having a comment explaining what it's for

The visual weight of a variable name should be proportional to the distance between definition and usage. Global env var in a distant config file: go with `LONG_CAPS_SNAKE_CASE` Local var restricted to a few lines that can be viewed all at once: `c` is plenty.

@ibuildthecloud First of all Vscode is a code editor and not an IDE, and second of all no, there's a bunch of code editors better than Vsslop, in which I don't have to wait 100ms in order for a character to appear on my screen

There's no chance any IDE is going to beat out VSCode. They can be slow but they will make the needed changes.

@samlambert Rewrite rustc in Zig

why don't we just rewrite zig in rust?

@hd_nvim So you generated some low quality trash code to make it compile low quality trash code that other people are gonna generate, bravo! By the way, you ever heard of arenas, no?.... Ok...

Zero - Vercel's new programming language for agents It keeps effects explicit, memory predictable, and compiler output structured so AI agents can read, repair, inspect, and ship small native programs together.

@oxcrowx Does it really matter if I'll have the best experience programming in Jai anyway

You'll have a better experience coding in Go, than in Odin. Try them both and see if I'm lying.

@croloris It doesn't matter because the code would be complete trash either way.

I wonder if GPT5.5 would have done a better job at translating Bun. Now Bun not only has a hard dependency on token expenditure to be maintained, but it's also locked into one model brand, while the competition can choose whichever model happens to be the best at the time.

@oxcrowx Public by default is correct, and the way Jai manages visibility is exactly the way it should be done in my opinion.

Public by default is wrong. It feels productive to use it for a moment. However since public API is smaller than private API, users will be annoyed when they have to later mark significantly more things as private, before they deploy their code. Then they will say Odin is bad.

@yarnf40580 @rfleury Very true, I think that after programming for a while, you realize that programming is simply just implementing something that you want in the simplest, most straightforward way possible and then semantically compressing that. And those modern tools don't seem to help as much...

Just dropped wgpu dependency in favor of using ash for github.com/rakivo/e2 and peak RSS dropped from ~125MB to ~100MB, and the executable size from ~9MB to ~5MB. Let the debloating sessions begin!

@Nekrolm Потому что людей в stable канале за людей не считают и все нужные фичи всегда оказываются в Найтли: кастомные Try, likely/unlikely, кастомные аллокаторы (не глобальные), также как и let chains до раст 2024 были в Найтли, concat_idents! и тд тп

Хм, Bun еще и nightly версию rustc требует... Традиции нестабильного Zig не отпускают