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530 posts

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@ntgcv

Katılım Temmuz 2022
65 Takip Edilen13 Takipçiler
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M@ntgcv·
@fuqekgs @SpencerBell479 @cancel_commies @DocLibertarian Then why are the academic requirements for white and Asian applicants higher than those for black and Hispanic? Maybe they predict communication of empathy in those populations, but not others?
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M@ntgcv·
@kevinaclarke @lilmoemusic @BrentAWilliams2 Ok, so why are academic standards for entry so much higher for white and Asian applicants? By the way these outcomes are pretty stupid. Just “matching” proves absolutely nothing. Anyone with a pulse can match
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K@kevinaclarke·
@lilmoemusic @ntgcv @BrentAWilliams2 It shows outcomes are the same/similar and in some instances the qualitative data looks stronger for black students.
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Brent A. Williams, MD
Brent A. Williams, MD@BrentAWilliams2·
If you are saying that “Black people need Black doctors” then you are a racist.
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M@ntgcv·
@lilmoemusic @BrentAWilliams2 Answer the question dumbass. Why is it so much more academically difficult for white and Asians to get into medical school?
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M@ntgcv·
@lilmoemusic @BrentAWilliams2 Oh my god. There’s an entire standard deviation between the mcat scores and a huge deviation between the gpas. What’s your explanation for that, exactly? Why are Asian and white standards so much higher?
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M@ntgcv·
@lilmoemusic @BrentAWilliams2 Then why are non black and non Hispanic docs held to higher academic standards on admission? Why can’t we seem to find that the scores among all the applicants are equal? Holistic factors only apply to minorities maybe?
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M@ntgcv·
@KNich_opines @drterrysimpson The implication is that black applicants have some secret sauce on their resumes that ALWAYS makes up for their academic deficiencies. But no one can put their finger on it. No one quite knows why they’re so “compassionate” and “good communicators” (Skin color is the answer)
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The Answer is NO
The Answer is NO@KNich_opines·
@drterrysimpson It seems you have broken their brains. The MCAT, LSAT, GMAT etc. are the only thing that can possibly determine whether a person is qualified. Otherwise standards have been lowered! Discrimination! Racism! The screams of people who can’t accept the truth.
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Dr Terry Simpson
Dr Terry Simpson@drterrysimpson·
No one is lowering standards but you thinking they are lowered. And that, is simple racism. It’s ok, you can be racist and admit it. Or you can say that maybe physicians and admissions committees of medical school know more than you do about this subject.
𝑃𝑜𝑙𝑖𝑡𝑖𝑐𝑠, 𝑃𝑜𝑙𝑖𝑐𝑖𝑒𝑠, 𝑃𝑜𝑝 𝐶𝑢𝑙@policywishes

The deflection is thick with this one. The issue isn't diversity but lowering standards and choosing applicants based on race is illegal and you can try to twist that any way you want but the DOJ enforces those laws of the Court. Patients need/should have the best qualified.

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M@ntgcv·
@Imnotbovvered They’re arguing for his side. Physicians in the comments are overwhelmingly lampooning this boomer fool and his fantasy notions against merit and academic achievement
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Nat Lee Meow
Nat Lee Meow@Imnotbovvered·
The average American reads at a 7th- to 8th-grade level. A bunch of them are in the comments arguing with this doctor.
Dr Terry Simpson@drterrysimpson

I disagree with the Department of Justice going after Yale School of Medicine over DEI admissions policies and arguing that objective metrics like GPA and MCAT scores should dominate admissions decisions. The evidence does not support the idea that standardized test scores alone identify the best physicians. The MCAT predicts performance on other multiple-choice exams reasonably well. What MCAT scores do NOT predict are clinical judgment, communication, bedside skill, or physician performance. Put another way: doctors who test well tend to do well on examinations. But test scores do not predict how well they care for patients in clinics, hospitals, surgery, or real-world medicine. Meanwhile, more diverse physician workforces are associated with better preventive care, greater trust, improved access, and lower mortality in underserved communities. There is no objective evidence that excluding minority applicants within a reasonable score range improves patient outcomes. We need minority physicians in this country, and we have the data to prove why. So when people insist that “objective measures” alone should determine admission into medicine — while ignoring the evidence about what actually improves patient care — I increasingly see that argument as less about merit and more about preserving exclusion under the comforting language of statistics. "Equality feels like oppression to those who are privileged"

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M@ntgcv·
@mattyglesias Politically challenging is putting it mildly. It’s politically impossible. Trump is simply a continuation of boomer luxury welfare. There is no hope for Natalism in a gerontocracy
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Matthew Yglesias
Matthew Yglesias@mattyglesias·
That would, of course, be politically challenging. But the existing GOP agenda of deficit-financed regressive tax cuts is also politically challenging. That’s why I find the lack of overt discussion of the party’s priorities and revealed preferences fascinating.
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Matthew Yglesias
Matthew Yglesias@mattyglesias·
An interesting feature of conservatism is that the right is very interested in fertility, yet nobody criticizes Trump for neither trying nor succeeding in doing anything about it. Nor does anyone ever express any doubt about the “tweet charts while doing nothing” strategy.
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Dr Terry Simpson
Dr Terry Simpson@drterrysimpson·
Listing famous Black conservatives you admire is not a rebuttal. It is the political equivalent of displaying certificates of racial permission. And again, you keep sneaking in the unsupported premise that modest differences in standardized test scores among already highly qualified applicants cleanly determine who is “more qualified” to become a physician. That is precisely the point under dispute. Medicine is not an SAT contest. Patients do not ask their surgeon for percentile rankings while being wheeled into the operating room. The deeper irony is that people who suddenly demand perfectly race-blind procedural purity in admissions remained astonishingly relaxed about legacy admissions, inherited privilege, prep industries, donor influence, and every other advantage that quietly benefited the familiar class structure for generations. Apparently those distortions were meritocratic. Only diversity became “racism.” We can show objective improvements in public health and communities and show that tests are a single measure but not the most important measure in a medical school community. You don’t know either the literature, nor what the test means, and yet you have an agenda and call out those who disagree with you as racist and attempt to purify your thoughts by stating you have people who are black that you admire. WOW - I never thought I’d hear such sad comments in this decade.
Andrew Branca Show@TheBrancaShow

Many of the men I most respect in the world are black men. Clarence Thomas. Thomas Sowell. Walter Williams. That doesn't mean less qualified black candidates should be given positions, based on their race, over more qualified white or Asian candidates. Because that would be RACIST.

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Greg Hayes
Greg Hayes@canuc_57·
@AmputationSuck @ProfDBernstein Very well stated Bryan. Standardized test have never been shown to be a predictor of success. They are full of racial and socioeconomic bias.
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David Bernstein
David Bernstein@ProfDBernstein·
The problem is that if you don’t believe that GPA and MCAT scores should dominate admissions decisions, why do they dominate admissions decisions for whites and Asians but not for others? Why not just take anyone who meets a certain minimum threshold by lottery?
Dr Terry Simpson@drterrysimpson

I disagree with the Department of Justice going after Yale School of Medicine over DEI admissions policies and arguing that objective metrics like GPA and MCAT scores should dominate admissions decisions. The evidence does not support the idea that standardized test scores alone identify the best physicians. The MCAT predicts performance on other multiple-choice exams reasonably well. What MCAT scores do NOT predict are clinical judgment, communication, bedside skill, or physician performance. Put another way: doctors who test well tend to do well on examinations. But test scores do not predict how well they care for patients in clinics, hospitals, surgery, or real-world medicine. Meanwhile, more diverse physician workforces are associated with better preventive care, greater trust, improved access, and lower mortality in underserved communities. There is no objective evidence that excluding minority applicants within a reasonable score range improves patient outcomes. We need minority physicians in this country, and we have the data to prove why. So when people insist that “objective measures” alone should determine admission into medicine — while ignoring the evidence about what actually improves patient care — I increasingly see that argument as less about merit and more about preserving exclusion under the comforting language of statistics. "Equality feels like oppression to those who are privileged"

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Xolotl
Xolotl@xolotl9x·
@AmputationSuck @ProfDBernstein Surgery, especially the super high paying specialities, (spine, CT etc) is pretty self-selective though, attracting the most super alpha types. The highest test score students usually prefer other specialities.
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M@ntgcv·
@AmputationSuck @ProfDBernstein Oh I got a million of them about DEI surgeons buddy. How about the Lithuanian woman who butchered half a dozen hearts before getting fired? We just needed her “diversity” sooo much that people had to die for it.
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M@ntgcv·
@RndmStreetMedic And yet medical schools argue this every day. LOOK AT THE ADMIT RATES FOR 99th vs 95th percentile!
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M@ntgcv·
@drterrysimpson Basically accusing program directors of being racist now. Let me guess, it’s just always been racism, and none of the dismissals have ever been legit? Great job protecting the public, doc
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Dr Terry Simpson
Dr Terry Simpson@drterrysimpson·
This statistic is being presented without context, which matters enormously. Black residents are disproportionately represented in programs serving high-acuity, underfunded, underserved populations and often face higher rates of bias reporting, isolation, lack of mentorship, and punitive remediation environments. Dismissal statistics alone do not prove inferior physician quality any more than incarceration statistics alone prove inherent criminality. And notice what is quietly missing from these arguments: Where is the evidence that Black physicians deliver worse patient outcomes? In fact, much of the literature points the other direction: improved trust, preventive care uptake, underserved access, and in some populations improved mortality outcomes. Medicine is difficult for everyone. Residency attrition is influenced by academic preparation, institutional support, burnout, bias, financial stress, and training culture. Pretending a raw disparity number settles the question biologically or intellectually is not science. It is ideology wearing a lab coat. And patients already do have the last word. They keep seeking physicians who listen to them, understand them, communicate well, and earn trust — qualities not fully captured by MCAT scores or by selective screenshots from social media.
Shycollie@shycollie

@drterrysimpson You’re sounding desperate, but ultimately patients will have the last word, currently they don’t seem too happy with the new physician work force you’re creating

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Dr. Christian Casteel
Dr. Christian Casteel@DrCasteelEM·
@Ambavalent2964 You’ll be pleased to know those test scores have zero bearing on or correlation to any medical/surgical performance as an attending.
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Dr. Christian Casteel
Dr. Christian Casteel@DrCasteelEM·
If you can’t understand how an applicant with a 507 MCAT who came from poverty, first to go to college, working while in school, and has no financial help is much more impressive and implies far better work ethic and perseverance than someone with a 512, rich parents, MCAT prep course, and never had a job…you’re a fucking dumbass.
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M@ntgcv·
@fuqekgs Why would I want my doctor to be SMART, after all?
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✨neuron divergent EKG slayer MD✨
Fun story! Clinical skills, especially hands on aren't associated with MCAT scores!
✨neuron divergent EKG slayer MD✨ tweet media
BlueOysterCargoCult@Ambavalent2964

@DrCasteelEM Yeah see if I’m getting cut open and my life or my child’s life is dependent on a difficult procedure I don’t particularly give af of background of the surgeon or all the privilege they might or might not have had I just want the one with the best objective performance

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M@ntgcv·
@AmputationSuck @fuqekgs Bruh, I know how to track your ACTs during your fem pops better than you do. Would you just tell me when you’re gonna unclamp? FOH
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✨neuron divergent EKG slayer MD✨
Here to say sometimes the highest MCAT/USMLE scorers aren't always the best physicians. You can ace a test, but if you don't know how to communicate with others and be considerate, you won't go to many places Plus there's evidence showing MCAT scores is associated with SES
The Notorious R.O.B.@robolivermd

@drterrysimpson For limited resources like slots at a top medical school, objective measures of competence like the high MCAT range should be the major factor in sorting applicants.

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M@ntgcv·
@drterrysimpson Omg. Lower mcat score people fail med school more often!
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Dr Terry Simpson
Dr Terry Simpson@drterrysimpson·
There is zero evidence that MCAT is an indicator of anything other than people who take tests well. It is not a measure of competence, and it is not a be all and end all for what makes a good physician. You've never been on a college admissions or med school admissions committee if you think everything can be cut and dried.
The Notorious R.O.B.@robolivermd

@drterrysimpson For limited resources like slots at a top medical school, objective measures of competence like the high MCAT range should be the major factor in sorting applicants.

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M@ntgcv·
@Magical_Answer “I can’t pass the test” Must be racism!
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M@ntgcv·
@drterrysimpson Dude it DOES show they failed more! We have the stats on this!!!
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Dr Terry Simpson
Dr Terry Simpson@drterrysimpson·
Also worth noting: this graph uses admissions data from 2013–2016 — over a decade old in admissions-cycle terms — based on the pre-2015 MCAT scale. Yet people present it today as if it were a current catastrophe unfolding in real time. The graph shows differences in admissions decisions among already highly qualified applicants. It does NOT show that the lower-scoring groups became worse physicians, had worse patient outcomes, failed medical school, or harmed patients more often. And notice something else: the graph is visually designed to make relatively narrow MCAT bands feel like a civilizational collapse. A 24–26 versus 30–32 on the old MCAT scale is meaningful, but it is not the difference between “competent” and “unsafe.” These are still students who completed difficult science curricula and qualified to apply to medical school. Meanwhile, medicine has strong evidence that physician diversity improves trust, preventive care uptake, underserved access, and even mortality outcomes in marginalized communities. So yes, admissions committees sometimes accept lower MCAT scores in the context of broader institutional goals. They always have. Legacy admissions, elite pipelines, donor influence, athletics, geography, military service, and rural recruitment all do the same thing. The outrage only seems to emerge when the beneficiaries are Black.
Anish Koka, MD@anish_koka

This is not trivial. Your averages are being used to mask pretty large gaps. 56% medical school admit rate for black applicants with a 24-26 mcat and a 3.2-3.39 gpa Same score range - Asians/whites have a 6-8% admit rate

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