Benjamin N Garren

In TEC as queer clergy my life is basically digging my bare feet into the broken glass the church dumps in our special segregated rooms. Hoping it embeds itself in my flesh so the floor is a bit clearer for the next generation of LGBTQ+ persons they force to walk there.

@dobleplusungood @wheeliebin69 @GarakHimself @DreyfusJames Language is ever evolving to help us communicate our lived experience. Gay couples involving trans men are not treated in society as heterosexual relationships, they are treated as gay couples.

@wokehtklim @wheeliebin69 @GarakHimself @DreyfusJames Gay men are homosexual i.e. the same sex. A couple consisting of a female who says she's a man and a man is a heterosexual couple i.e. they are different sexes. Language is not endlessly fungible & words common meanings certainly aren't changed by fiat.

Twank blocked me right after this exchange… Desperate stuff indeed…

@wheeliebin69 @GarakHimself @dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames Gay couples involving one or two trans men are gay. Reducing being gay to performing certain sex acts is homophobic. Gay men engage in a variety of sex acts, some don't engage in sex at all.

@wokehtklim @GarakHimself @dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames Would you still consider yourself gay if you had penis in vagina sex with a trans identified female?

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself "Anisogamous" literally translates to "unequal marriage". Your suggestion is that the structure of human society and the lens through which we understand all human biology is that we sexually reproduce with unequal gametes. While this is a choice, it is not a requirement.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Nobody's suggesting that. I am, however, stating there are exactly two human sexes. I don't know what point you're trying to make, is it that people are trans because they have DSDs, or is it some people have bigger cocks than others so trans?

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself We are "unequal marriage", that's reality? Prioritizing fertility and progenitive sex acts as the means for valuing a person in society creates a society in which women are inferior and LGBTQ individuals have no value. Why are we going back to that?

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself We're anisogamous. That's reality.

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Human biology, from our complex genetics to even more complex phenotypes, doesn't create two distinct separate sex groups. It creates spectrums with dense groupings and a lot of overlap, bridging, subgroups, and diversity. That is the reality.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself The knowledge that there are 2 human sexes is not 'supremacist ideology'. It is a fact. Even the intersex conditions I'm sure you'd like to blether on about occur only in females or only in males. Facts are just true, whether you like them, whether you accept them, or not.

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself So do sexists say regarding feminism. So do racists say regarding racial equality. So do homophobes say regarding LGB equality. This is what human rights laws do, they restrict the capacity of supremacist ideology to be active in a society so that minorities are safe.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Then their requests are that we deny reality. Their requests are that we give up freedom of speech and use the words some other people want us to use. Their request is to allow heterosexuals to harass lesbians. Saying "Fuck Off" to all of that is not abuse.

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself You oppose the LGB community in its support of trans persons. You lift up GC Lesbians as they seek to perpetuate the same transphobia that you do. This animosity to the trans community and the human rights laws that protect them is the issue.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself What you call GC Lesbians don't want men at their events. As a man, I'm fine with that, it's not 'androphobia'. I do question why any man, even one who says he is a woman, would want to insert himself in an event which is for females only. Being creepy isnt a human right.

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself The requests of the trans community is that we value trans women as women and trans men as men. You want society to reject that request, to allow for the systemic abuse of trans persons, and to ignore the discrimination and abuse of trans persons by individuals.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Nobody is saying "society must reject all requests of the trans community". It is simple fact that no humans change sex. Heterosexuality is not homosexuality.

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Saying trans women are men and trans men are women and that society must reject all requests of the trans community for support and equality is transphobia. That is what GC Lesbians are doing and why their request break human rights laws.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Doing what you want, all the time, is not a human right and does not deserve protection. GC lesbians aren't being 'transphobic' by choosing to have events that exclude men who say they are men or men who say they are women, their discrimination is, obviously, on the basis of sex.

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Historic lesbian and gay orgs want trans persons to be included and often have included them for generations. These are the groups who work for trans inclusion in human rights laws. GC Lesbians exist in antagonism to the greater LGB community in their maintenance of transphobia.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself In each case you put forward, they were wanted, they were elected. Not having heterosexual people at events for homosexual people is not transphobia, in the same way that excluding me is not heterophobia.

@DreyfusJames @GarakHimself @dobleplusungood I value human rights protections for all individuals regardless of sex, race, gender, or sexuality. Such laws are the ones inhibiting GC Lesbians from being actively transphobic. Your argument is that trans persons shouldn't be included in human rights protections.

@GarakHimself @wokehtklim @dobleplusungood He’s not a serious person. Straight up lying now…🙄

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself That you are applying one set of rules to issues of racism, sexism, and homophobia: abusive to say no, trailblazers enter into spaces they are not wanted. And another to transphobia: not abusive to say no, childish to enter into spaces they are not wanted.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself What point are you trying to make? Some people may be trailblazers. However we will never see a male trans man or a female trans woman, and there will never be a heterosexual lesbian or gay man.

@GarakHimself @DreyfusJames @dobleplusungood Sexuality is a spectrum with a lot of complexity. It isn't all Kinsey 0s and 6s, with a few bisexual 3s running around. It is physical, psychological, emotional, erotic, mental, spiritual, and more in where it hits us as humans.

@dobleplusungood @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Neville Bonner, Enid Lyons, Dorothy Tangney were not childish for seeking seats in parliament and the no that had kept them from such was abusive. LGB spaces have included trans persons for generations, bringing transphobia into those spaces is childish entitlement.

@wokehtklim @DreyfusJames @GarakHimself Saying no to an adult is not abuse. The question is why would an adult seek entry to an event or space that is clearly not for them? It displays a childish level of entitlement and disregard for the concerns of all the others who choose to be there.

@GarakHimself @DreyfusJames @dobleplusungood The sad thing is that you take a character from DS9 where the mutability of Dax's gender and the implications of that for her friends/lovers is a reoccurring plot device... and use it as a face to abuse the trans community.

@GarakHimself @DreyfusJames @dobleplusungood It is no more difficult to respectfully turn a trans man down at the gay bar than any other man in the place. It is no more difficult to curb one's attraction to a guy because they are not down for the sex acts you are into on account of them being trans than any other reason.