TradRevivalOperator 🇻🇦🌲

I propose a new Texas flag:

@deorsumspiram No worries. It's totally understandable. I am racist though.

@Isaiahfloz sorry I think I misinterpreted your post as having racist connotations if it was a misunderstanding I genuinely apologize

Why are all these indians drowning and getting electrocuted on the timeline? You know what, maybe it's best not to know.

@deorsumspiram Huh.

@Isaiahfloz Not very Christlike of you to speak about other people like that, is it

@TomlinsonCJ That is very true I feel.

@Isaiahfloz If you banned communion in the hand and extraordinary eucharistic ministers, a lot of people would probably stop going to Mass, too.

I posted this as a half jest in light of the recent hubub about runners and attire at mass, but it's opened my eyes in more ways than one. The replies to this vindicate my belief that if Catholic Churches globally enforced a dress code like the one below or similar, then a lot of people would simply not go to mass rather than conform to the standard. Quite telling.

@ligurio19761808 @ClassicalTheis @ProtecttheFaith Yes. You can.

@Isaiahfloz @ClassicalTheis @ProtecttheFaith It means that if your critique were sincere it would cause you to reject any benefit from it. Can you critique usury while running a payday loan store?

"It will take a hundred years to heal the wounds left by the Second Vatican Council" -Giuseppe Cardinal Siri (1906-1989) , Archbishop of Genoa, the pope we should have had instead of John XXIII, Paul VI, John Paul I, John Paul II There would have been no Vatican II or Francis if Cardinal Siri had become pope

@ShamelessPopery @redeemed_zoomer @The_Catechumen How is he gonna talk badly of St. Francis de Sales? The dude is on something.

@redeemed_zoomer says that St. Francis de Sales, the famed "Gentleman Saint," was "either a moron or a liar." @The_Catechumen and I sat down (in weirdly-matching shirts) to unpack why we think he's neither, and offers some great arguments against the Reformation. youtube.com/watch?v=i3dRE1…

I understand, I tend to get ahead of myself and can be long winded, hence why I use a lot of screencaps and the like. I believe we all seek to more faithfully live out our Catholic faith, I just think in recent decades there has been too much confusion and poor catechesis/historical study, of what the Church teaches. I pray for you brother.

@Isaiahfloz I appreciate the polite discourse and further learning on the topic. It’s rare for sedes/trads to engage in good faith at all (in my past experience, this thread has been much more productive). I just can’t engage you with much substance using so little characters is all.

I am begging. Pleading with the pope respecter and pope defenders who are good intentioned and well meaning. The newest thing is not the most authoritative. The 3 pillars of Roman Catholicism are Sacred Scripture, Sacred Tradition, and the Magisterium of the Church. Newest thing is not best thing guys. Really need to hammer this home for a lot of you.

Ah, well, I don't mean to overwhelm you but I could easily continue to quote Papal statements, and encyclicals condemning the heresy of religious liberty. This notion of religious liberty has already been expressly qualified as heretical by Pope Pius VII in his brief Post Tam Diuturnas, so there is no doubt about the matter.

@Isaiahfloz That’s not at all what just happened, it’s a continuation of my prior argument. I also only have 180 characters so I can’t do these huge posts you’re doing. I’m trying to engage with the arguments with the characters I have available, which is obviously difficult.

@barikofthetiers You're hanging the entire validity of DH on 3 words, and thinking it has more weight than the magisterial teaching of multiple popes and encyclicals going back centuries? That's a bold strategy.

@Isaiahfloz “Within due limits” is important. V2 isn’t giving blank checks to false religions, but narrowing the scope of the State’s right to thought-police. Catholic confessional state is also not “dogma.”

DH #3: "So the state, whose proper purpose it is to provide for the temporal common good, should certainly recognize and promote the religious life of its citizens. With equal certainty it exceeds the limits of its authority, if it takes upon itself to direct or to prevent religious activity." How you can read that, and then read Pope Leo XIII's strong words on the subject and not walk away confused is beyond me.

I have: DH #2: "This Vatican synod declares that the human person has a right to religious freedom. Such freedom consists in this, that all should have such immunity from coercion by individuals, or by groups, or by any human power, that no one should be forced to act against his conscience in religious matters, nor prevented from acting according to his conscience, whether in private or in public, within due limits." It is a dogma of the Catholic Church that states have a right, and a duty, to prevent false religions from publicly propagating and practicing their false faiths. States must do this to protect the common good - the good of souls, which is harmed by the public dissemination of evil. This is why the Catholic Church has always taught that Catholicism should be the only religion of the state; and that the State should exclude and forbid the public profession and propagation of any other. Pope Pius XI's Syllabus of Errors condemns your notion and the notions of DH.

@barikofthetiers These are just a few I have saved, there is centuries of Church teaching on religious liberty that are at odds with what DH says.

I don't know how that pertains to our discussion thus far. The Church has condemned religious liberty historically. Here we see that prior Magisterial teaching and direct papal encyclicals, have condemned religious liberty, not just because other religious are false, but because it is not in accord with the natural good and end that man is called to. You do not have a "right" to sin, only the right to know, love and serve God.

It doesn't have to be declared ex cathedra to be a perennial teaching of the Church. There have been less than 5 genuine Ex Cathedra statements in the span of the Church and that number is debated among Theologians. An example I'd cite would be the idea of religious liberty. The Church in her doctrine and multiple papal statements of the past has condemned that as a heresy and antithetical to the Light and fullness of Truth the Church offers.

@Isaiahfloz Sure, so what specific teaching declared via ex cathedra has been deemed null and void by post-Vatican II Popes? No one seems to be able to answer this question. Doctrine is subject to change, not dogma.

A very easy analogy proving my premise is if an older teaching declared via council or ex cathedra, was weighed against a more modern teaching seemingly at odds with the earlier one, but made via an interview or informal setting. You as a Catholic, are not bound by the newer teaching. You would be bound by the perennial teaching of the Church, as it's doctrines are unchanging.

@Isaiahfloz It requires a level of arrogance to believe that you, as a laymen, are in a better position to assess the matter than the Holy Father. What decides what is “more authoritative” in your view? I’m unaware of any significant changes in dogma that bring about these questions.

@barikofthetiers Why do you assume it lies with me. I appeal to the Traditions and immutable teachings of the Church and Magisterium. Weightier and more authoritative proclamations and teachings have more force than newer less authoritative ones. Simple as.

@Isaiahfloz I’m curious what makes you think the authority lies with you.

@Tom_McGovern_72 There are differing theological opinions on that topic, but there is no binding, defined dogma on that issue that the Church holds the faithful to. Life begins at conception. When ensoulment occurs is open to debate and interpretation.

@Isaiahfloz So you still believe in the delayed ensoulment of the fetus?

@Tom_McGovern_72 The teachings of the Church are immutable and unchanging. This way of thinking is modernism.

@Isaiahfloz Just because it was taught in the past, doesn't make it right. I'm sure Pope respecters understand this and defer to the reigning Pope.

@darkgroyp @Sirgoseric @GenMarkRW "If you make an argument proving my stance and statements are wrong, I won't care that much." Okay bro. I'll just leave then. Have a nice life.

@Isaiahfloz @Sirgoseric @GenMarkRW And I don't tend to take the faith of people defending material schism seriously if you want to make the argument that this is not formally schismatic because there is no intent to break unity with Rome you can do that but at that point I don't care that much

When trads complain about the conciliar Church and the modernist influence infecting it, this is what we mean. This harlot should have never been allowed on the grounds, let alone to offer her "blessings."