Scott Alexander@slatestarcodex
I disagree with all of this on the epistemic level of "it's not true", and additionally disagree with your comms strategy of undermining EAs.
On the epistemic level - I haven't seen EAs (other than SBF) do a lot of lying, equivocating, or even being particularly shy about their beliefs. I don't know exactly who you're talking about, but Holden made a personal blog post saying that his p(doom) was 50%, and said:
>>> ""I constantly tell people, I think this is a terrifying situation. If everyone thought the way I do, we would probably just pause AI development and start in a regime where you have to make a really strong safety case before you move forward with it."
Dario said there's a 25% chance "things go really, really badly", and in terms of a pause:
>>> "I wish we had 5 to 10 years [before AGI]. The reason we can't [slow down and] do that is because we have geopolitical adversaries building the same technology at a similar pace. It's very hard to have an enforceable agreement where they slow down and we slow down. [But] if we can just not sell the chips to China, then this isn't a question of competition between the U.S. and China. This is a question between me and Demis - which I am very confident we can work out."
This is basically my position - I would add "we should try to negotiate with China, but keep this as a backup plan if it fails", but my guess is Dario would also add this and just isn't optimistic. I agree he's written some other things (especially in Adolescence of Technology) that sound weirdly schizophrenic, and more on this later, but I give him a lot of credit for paragraphs like:
>>> "I think it would be absurd to shrug and say, “Nothing to worry about here!” But, faced with rapid AI progress, that seems to be the view of many US policymakers, some of whom deny the existence of any AI risks, when they are not distracted entirely by the usual tired old hot-button issues. Humanity needs to wake up, and this essay is an attempt—a possibly futile one, but it’s worth trying—to jolt people awake."
Meanwhile, you seem to be treating all these people as basically equivalent to Gary Marcus. I think if you don't mean these people in particular, you should specify who you're talking about, and what things that they've said strike you in this way.
Absent that, I think this "debate" isn't about OpenPhil or Anthropic failing to say they're extremely worried, failing to say that catastrophe is a very plausible outcome, or failing to say that they think slowing down AI would be good if possible. It's about OpenPhil in particular being pretty careful how they phrase things for public consumption. And I think any attempt to attack them for this should start with an acknowledgement that MIRI is directly responsible for all of our current problems by doing things like introducing DeepMind to its funders, getting Sam Altman and Elon Musk into AI, and building up excitement around "superintelligence" in Silicon Valley. I think if 2010-MIRI had slightly more strategicness and willingness to ask itself "hey, is this PR strategy likely to backfire?", you might not have told a bunch of the worst people in the world that AI was going to be super-powerful and that whoever invested in it would be ahead in a race that might make them hundreds of billions of dollars (and yes, you did add "and then destroy the world" - but if you had been more strategic, you might have considered that investors wouldn't hear that last part as loudly).
(you could argue that you're not against strategicness in general, just talking about this one issue of saying cleanly that AI is very dangerous. But my impression is that Holden, Dario, have said this, many times - see examples above. What they haven't said is "the situation is totally hopeless and every strategy except pausing has literally no chance of working", but that isn't a comms problem, that's because they genuinely believe something different from you. And also, I frequently encountering people who say things like "Scott, I'm glad you wrote about X in way Y - it made me take AI risk seriously, after I'd previously been turned off of it by encountering MIRI". I think a substantial reason that Dario's writing sometimes seems schizophrenic when talking about AI risks is that he's trying to convey that they're serious while also trying to signal "I swear I'm not one of those MIRI people" so that his writing can reach some of the people you've driven away. I don't think you drive them away because you're "honest", I think it's just about normal issues around framing and theory-of-mind for your audience.)
I don't actually want to re-open the "MIRI helped start DeepMind and OpenAI!!!" war or the "MIRI is arrogant and alienating!!! war - we've both been through both of these a million times - but I increasingly feel like a chump trying to cooperate while you're defecting. This is the foundation of my comms worry. Your claim that "governments are incredibly trigger-happy about banning things...there's a long history of governments successfully coordinating to ban things dramatically less dangerous than superintelligent AI" is too glib - I don't think there's ever been a ban on building something as economically-valuable and far-along as AI, executed competently enough that it would work if applied cookie-cutter to the AI situation. You're trying to do a really difficult thing here. I respect this - all of our options are bad and unlikely to work, the situation is desperate, and I have no plan better than playing a portfolio of all the different desperate hard strategies in the hopes that one of them works. But my impression is that the rest of the field is executing this portfolio plan admirably, but MIRI and a few other PauseAI people are trying to sabotage every other strategy in the portfolio in the hope of forcing people into theirs.
(I think if you guys had your way, Anthropic would never have been founded, no safety-minded people would ever have joined labs, and the current world would be a race between XAI, Meta, and OpenAI, all of which would have a Yann LeCun style approach to safety, and none of which would have alignment teams beyond the don't-say-bad-words level. We wouldn't have the head of the leading AI lab writing letters to policymakers begging them to "jolt awake", we wouldn't have a substantial fraction of world compute going to Jan Leike's alignment efforts, we wouldn't have Ilya sitting on $50 billion for some super-secret alignment project -- just Mark Zuckerberg stomping on a human face forever. In exchange, we would have won a couple more years of timeline, which would have been pointless, because timeline isn't measured in distance from the year 1 AD, it's measured in distance between some level of woken-up-ness and some point of danger, and the woken-up-ness would be pushed forward at the same rate the danger was.)
I support your fight-for-a-pause strategy in theory, and I would like to support it with praxis, but right now I feel very conflicted about this, because I worry that any support or oxygen you guys get will be spent knifing other safety advocates, while Sam Altman happily builds AGI regardless.
