ChaChee

@daScrounger @RevReads289 When did those Jews in Acts 2 receive the Holy Spirit and thus become regenerated? Before or after they believed they had murdered the Christ, asking, “what MUST we do”?

Thats no reason to throw out the bath with the bath water. There is no understanding without direct contact with the Holy Spirit providing the knowledge needed at Gospel hearing. Man is spiritually dead and cannot understand without the Holy Spirits engagement. This is what its meant by illumination of the Gospel. It takes more than reading John 3:16 on a sign at a football game.

My departure from Calvinism began when I decided to examine the proof texts for Irresistible or Effectual Grace. I came to the conclusion that no passage directly taught it but I still accepted it because I believed it was a logical necessity even if it wasn't found in the Bible.

@Bubblebathgirl The puffiness of his face is gone. Pretty amazing after only a few weeks.

Tiger Woods is back home after completing a month of rehabilitation in Zurich, Switzerland. The 50-year-old golf legend was spotted walking on the tarmac at Palm Beach International Airport on Wednesday after flying in from Europe. Woods shared that this time away was necessary “in order for me to prioritize my well-being and work toward lasting recovery.” He remains focused on returning to the game he loves. Wishing Tiger continued strength and success on his journey ahead. Here’s to better days and getting back on the ⛳ Think Tiger still has some championships left in him? I do. (Video: AI)

@BenGuptill I thought you were claiming it is man’s moral righteousness that is the CAUSE of being alive.

Indeed… and the indwelling is an inheritance through the Abrahamic covenant. It was foreshadowed in Abraham through circumcision. It comes AFTER you believe the gospel. Ephesians 1:13-14 (NASB95) 13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation--having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of God’s own possession, to the praise of His glory. The indwelling is an Abrahamic promise. Galatians 3:14 (NASB95) in order that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we would receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. Galatians 3:18 (NASB95) For if the inheritance is based on law, it is no longer based on a promise; but God has granted it to Abraham by means of a promise. Romans 4:11 (NASB95) and Abraham received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while uncircumcised, so that he might be the father of all who believe without being circumcised, that righteousness might be credited to them, Romans 2:29 (NASB95) But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.

OrthoBro says believing the gospel isn’t enough to be saved. “If you declare with your mouth, ‘Jesus is Lord,’ and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” -Rom. 10:9

@BenGuptill Mans spirit becomes “alive” through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit for those IN CHRIST, because of Christs righteousness accomplished through his death, burial, and resurrection.

Romans 8:10 NASB95 - 10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness. What is the cause of the spirit being alive? (Answer: righteousness) Galatians 3:21 NASB95 - 21 Is the Law then contrary to the promises of God? May it never be! For if a law had been given which was able to impart life, then righteousness would indeed have been based on law. What imparted life? (Answer: righteousness)

@BenGuptill None of that means righteousness is the CAUSE of life as you claimed.

Correct, these are not my claims... these are the Bible's claims. Proverbs 10:16 NASB95 - 16 The wages of the righteous is life, The income of the wicked, punishment. Romans 8:10 NASB95 - 10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness. Romans 5:16-17 NASB95 - 16 The gift is not like [that which came] through the one who sinned; for on the one hand the judgment [arose] from one [transgression] resulting in condemnation, but on the other hand the free gift [arose] from many transgressions resulting in justification. 17 For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ. Galatians 3:21 NASB95 - 21 Is the Law then contrary to the promises of God? May it never be! For if a law had been given which was able to impart life, then righteousness would indeed have been based on law. To have life, you must be credited with righteousness. Matthew 5:20 NASB95 - 20 "For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses [that] of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven. Philippians 3:9 NASB95 - 9 and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from [the] Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which [comes] from God on the basis of faith, Galatians 3:11 YLT - 11 and that in law no one is declared righteous with God, is evident, because 'The righteous by faith shall live;' Hebrews 10:38 YLT - 38 and 'the righteous by faith shall live,' and 'if he may draw back, My soul hath no pleasure in him,' Let look at the parallel between Abraham's covenant promise and Daniel's prophecy of eternal life: Genesis 15:5-6 NASB95 - 5 And He took him outside and said, "Now look toward the heavens, and count the stars, if you are able to count them." And He said to him, "So shall your seed be." 6 Then he believed in the LORD; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness. Daniel 12:1-3 NASB95 - 1 "Now at that time Michael, the great prince who stands [guard] over the sons of your people, will arise. And there will be a time of distress such as never occurred since there was a nation until that time; and at that time your people, everyone who is found written in the book, will be rescued. 2 "Many of those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake, these to everlasting life, but the others to disgrace [and] everlasting contempt. 3 "Those who have insight will shine brightly like the brightness of the expanse of heaven, and those who lead the many to righteousness, like the stars forever and ever. Even David prophesies of Christ and His righteousness. Psalm 22:1, 18, 31 NASB95 - 1 For the choir director; upon Aijeleth Hashshahar. A Psalm of David. My God, my God, why have You forsaken me? Far from my deliverance are the words of my groaning. ... 18 They divide my garments among them, And for my clothing they cast lots. ... 31 They will come and will declare His righteousness To a people who will be born, that He has performed [it.]

@BenGuptill “Let’s look at the first person who was saved by grace through faith IN the gospel of Jesus Christ.” Did you not read what you wrote???? And…righteousness is the CAUSE of life??? These are not your original claims. Whose conjecture are you pulling from?

Yet, I have given you 2 passages in their full context to say that Abraham was made righteous for his faith, and that the cause of life is righteousness, and yet you cannot provide a single passage which says Abraham was "added to the body." It should be obvious that the "body" didn't exist in Abraham's day. The gospel itself is Abrahamic and preceded the Law of Moses by 430 years. Galatians 3:8, 15-18 NASB95 - 8 The Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, [saying,] "ALL THE NATIONS WILL BE BLESSED IN YOU." ... 15 Brethren, I speak in terms of human relations: even though it is [only] a man's covenant, yet when it has been ratified, no one sets it aside or adds conditions to it. 16 Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. He does not say, "And to seeds," as [referring] to many, but [rather] to one, "And to your seed," that is, Christ. 17 What I am saying is this: the Law, which came four hundred and thirty years later, does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise. 18 For if the inheritance is based on law, it is no longer based on a promise; but God has granted it to Abraham by means of a promise. Abraham's covenant was ratified in Genesis 15 when God passed through the blood of the covenant as a pillar of fire. Once ratified, it can no longer have conditions added to it, so the law of Moses which came 430 years later did not add conditions to Abraham's covenant of righteousness through faith. It should be plainly obvious that this preceded the ekklasia (the Church) by 2,000 years as well as the incarnation of Jesus' body.

@BenGuptill @DPGBehler You are grossly adding to scripture here, which, is a huge problem. There is no explicit claim that Abraham was the FIRST to be added to the body of Christ under the new covenant codified by the gospel.

Lets look at the first person who was saved by grace through faith in the gospel of Jesus Christ. To know this, we must know "saved from what." Saved from death and rewarded with eternal life. Ephesians 2:1, 5 NASB95 - 1 And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, ... 5 even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), What must you have to have life? Since death came by sin, then life comes through righteousness. To be saved from death, you need to be justified as righteous. That is what it means to be "saved" - to be justified as righteous. Galatians 2:16 NASB95 - 16 nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified. Romans 3:26, 28 NASB95 - 26 for the demonstration, [I say,] of His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. ... 28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law. Proverbs 10:16 NASB95 - 16 The wages of the righteous is life, The income of the wicked, punishment. Romans 6:23 NASB95 - 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. So who was the first person saved by grace through faith in the gospel of Jesus Christ? Galatians 3:8, 16 NASB95 - 8 The Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, [saying,] "ALL THE NATIONS WILL BE BLESSED IN YOU." ... 16 Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. He does not say, "And to seeds," as [referring] to many, but [rather] to one, "And to your seed," that is, Christ. Genesis 15:5-6 NASB95 - 5 And He took him outside and said, "Now look toward the heavens, and count the stars, if you are able to count them." And He said to him, "So shall your seed be." 6 Then he believed in the LORD; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness. Romans 4:11-12, 16 NASB95 - 11 and Abraham received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while uncircumcised, so that he might be the father of all who believe without being circumcised, that righteousness might be credited to them, 12 and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also follow in the steps of the faith of our father Abraham which he had while uncircumcised. ... 16 For this reason [it is] by faith, in order that [it may be] in accordance with grace, so that the promise will be guaranteed to all the descendants, not only to those who are of the Law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all, Abraham was the first to be made righteous for his faith in Christ. This was 430 years before the Law of Moses existed (Gal 3:15-18). God preached the gospel of Jesus Christ to him and showed him a vision of Jesus in Genesis 15. Genesis 15:1 NASB95 - 1 After these things the word of the LORD came to Abram in a vision, saying, "Do not fear, Abram, I am a shield to you; Your reward shall be very great." John 8:56 NASB95 - 56 "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw [it] and was glad." God showed Abraham a vision of Jesus and preached the gospel to him and when he believed, God credited him with Christ's righteousness. So Abraham was the first person saved by grace through faith in the gospel. This was 2,000 years before the Church existed. So salvation preceded the church by a long, long time. This why in Luke we read Abraham was in Paradise. Luke 16:24-26 NASB95 - 24 "And he cried out and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.' 25 "But Abraham said, 'Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony. 26 'And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and [that] none may cross over from there to us.' So to be saved, you need to be made righteous, just as Abraham was made righteous for his faith in the gospel of Jesus Christ. In fact, it is the act of believing the gospel which qualifies you as a descendant of Abraham and an inheritor of Christ's righteousness which was given to Abraham and promised to his descendants. When you have the same faith in the same gospel which Abraham believed in, you qualify as his descendants and heirs of his blessing. Galatians 3:6-9, 26, 29 NASB95 - 6 Even so Abraham BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS RECKONED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS. 7 Therefore, be sure that it is those who are of faith who are sons of Abraham. 8 The Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, [saying,] "ALL THE NATIONS WILL BE BLESSED IN YOU." 9 So then those who are of faith are blessed with Abraham, the believer. ... 26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. ... 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's descendants, heirs according to promise.

@BenGuptill @DPGBehler When does Christ add you to the church? You claim salvation exists outside the body, the church, of Christ. Show your proof.

@423chachee @DPGBehler Irrelevant because only those who are saved are added to the body... so being added to the body is not being saved.

@BenGuptill @DPGBehler No. What was the chronological point from which they were added to the body?

Incorrect. Those who were saved (the saving has already been done) were added to the church... so the condition of being added to the church was that they had to have already been saved. Therefore, it is incorrect to say that being added to the church equates to being saved, as being saved is a prerequisite of being added to the church. The passage identifies a group of persons (those who had been saved) and tells us what happened to that group - they were added to the church. So at the point where they were saved, they were not part of the church... so being added to the church is not part of salvation but comes after one is saved.

@9INE0hS8NT @BenGuptill @DPGBehler They claim to be sourced in scripture. Cite where one becomes a member of the Roman Catholic Church™️.

@423chachee @BenGuptill @DPGBehler They’re sources in Scripture, so by that standard, they’re sourced in what God has said.

@9INE0hS8NT @BenGuptill @DPGBehler Christs church is spiritual and is physically manifested by way of her members. These “churches” you are referring to are likely denominations, whose etiology is sourced in human leaders and by definition, not Christ.

@423chachee @BenGuptill @DPGBehler The Body of Christ is Spiritual, expressed my physical churches, but the Body itself is not one physical institution.

@9INE0hS8NT @BenGuptill @DPGBehler One specific institution indeed. Denom- means to divide. Denominationalism literally divides the body of Christ into sects, tribes, denominations. Said tribes are routinely sourced to a human leader. It’s why Paul specifically rebuked the church at Corinth.

@423chachee @BenGuptill @DPGBehler If Ben has a biblical understanding of what the Church is, He’s right, we don’t join the Body of Christ, we are joined to it, and the church isn’t one specific institution.

@9INE0hS8NT @BenGuptill @DPGBehler I’ll answer right after Ben responds to my post. In the meantime, is Ben incorrect?

@423chachee @BenGuptill @DPGBehler I’m pretty sure I asked you a question

@9INE0hS8NT @BenGuptill @DPGBehler So you agree that Ben is incorrect?

@423chachee @BenGuptill @DPGBehler Beautiful, now what does the Bible teach us the church actually is?

@BenGuptill @DPGBehler You cannot be saved outside of Christs church.

Yeah... the Bible never says you have to join a church to be saved... it says if you believe you will be saved. “By grace you have been saved through faith…” — Ephesians 2:8–9 “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved…” — Acts 16:31 “If you confess with your mouth ‘Jesus is Lord’ and believe in your heart… you will be saved.” — Romans 10:9 Not one word in these passages about joining a church to be saved. Acts 16:30-34 NASB95 - 30 and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" 31 They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household." 32 And they spoke the word of the Lord to him together with all who were in his house. 33 And he took them that [very] hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized, he and all his [household.] 34 And he brought them into his house and set food before them, and rejoiced greatly, having believed in God with his whole household.

@Soteriology101 Coupling your (purported) identity in Christ with a human leaders name was rebuked by Paul to the church in Corinth. Where do you all obtain the authority to be followers of Paul, Calvin, Molina, etc?

If you all “only quote scripture” then you wouldn’t be Calvinists.

@DPGBehler They call their priests “father”. That’s a non-starter. Anything that follows must be disregarded.

I have never been more turned off from the Orthodox Church than I am now, and I was already far from it.

@AngelaBelcamino Same reason they hated the Ron Paul.

Can someone explain, in the simplest way possible, why a faction of the right despises Thomas Massie?

@DPGBehler @ChrisGalanek Divide over it? That’s the entire premise of coupling one’s identity in Calvinism™️ , Molonism™️, Arminianism™️, Paulinism™️, etc..

@ChrisGalanek It’s okay to hold to it and defend it. It’s not okay to divide over it.

Unpopular opinion: There is no crisis in the church, and people are not leaving it in droves, because of “millions of years” teaching. It is a mid-20th century movement that infected mainstream evangelicalism that says anything other than a young earth is dangerous or apostasy. Before that, there was lots of open debate and liberty among faithful believers regarding the age of the earth. It being a point of division came later. As you see, men like Boice, Spurgeon, and Warfield held different views than Ken Ham demands.

@Cam_Pain1 @ThomasEWoods @JayTC53 @Cam_Pain1 yeah, I couldn’t refute Toms question either.

@ThomasEWoods @JayTC53 Tom, can you name one conservative who goes on CNN, cries racism over a meme, and demands Trump apologize to the Obama’s? Or is that just your boy Massie?

Thomas Massie is not a Republican, he is not MAGA, he is not America First. He is a Democrat operative. That is why he is being primaried. Thank you for your attention on this matter.