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jake

@jake62372619

Katılım Şubat 2022
15 Takip Edilen2 Takipçiler
jake
jake@jake62372619·
@getheode @ishan_para43481 what did I leave out lol? you literally made up words she didn't say. he asks if she is a capitalist, she says she wouldn't say that, then starts contrasting herself woth Warren who said she is a capitalist and points out a private sector existing doesn't imply capitalism
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Ishan
Ishan@ishan_para43481·
When critiquing power becomes your *entire* political persona you start to lose all interest in actually doing anything substantive to build socialist power or advance socialism because “muh power = bad” So instead you do nothing at at all and somehow feel proud of it
James🔻@GoodVibePolitik

No one seems to have a real answer for “what happens if AOC wins and then oversees the bombing of ____” which would be a near guarantee given our global military spread. With no congressional majority or even plurality either like what would we even be able to do? Censure? Lmao.

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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@getheode @ishan_para43481 not going to argue with you if you're just openly being in bad faith and moving goalposts lol. actually watch the clip! she certainly never described herself as not a socialist, he asked her if she's a capitalist and she said no! not even your quote there is correct lol
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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@riplaika @cyclops_psyops @escargotpro_ Go actually watch that interview because she specifically does not ever describe herself as a capitalist despite the interviewer trying to get her to repeatedly lol
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daniel 🐌
daniel 🐌@escargotpro_·
AOC is communicating with dsa now+ always has been lol there are very regular meetings with her office & impromptu calls/texts with her or her team all the time - why do all kinds of random ppl insist this isnt the case of 5 federal endorsed electeds she is the most communicative
Mateba@NewSweezyite

I'm repeating myself at this point but the fact that AOC isn't communicating with us *now* and that the DSA isn't launching the campaign is a sign that the idea of any "DSA presidency" in any meaningful sense is dead in the water

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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@getheode @ishan_para43481 When did she say she isn't a socialist? I can't even recall her ever saying anything positive about capitalism despite a million interview questions asking her to lol
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Saint Jiub ☭ 🇵🇸
@ishan_para43481 How does electing an imperialist who by her own self-description is not a socialist “advance socialism,” person with US presidents in their pfp
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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@JBrown_679 @UtilityCalc @GoodVibePolitik I don't know because I never said they would lol? Again, read the replies, you said 99% of voters won't be paying attention by convention and I am just disagreeing with that, as the majority of primary voters will be paying attention by then!
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J Brown
J Brown@JBrown_679·
@jake62372619 @UtilityCalc @GoodVibePolitik in what world are people gonna stop paying attention to a presidential election 15 months before it takes place? if DSA endorses AOC 15 months before the election, then that’s 15 months of fox news and cnn saying “DSA backed candidate AOC” every single day
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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@JBrown_679 @UtilityCalc @GoodVibePolitik no I didn't lol??? you said if we wait it's fine because 99% of voters won't be paying attention yet anyways and I said that's wrong and convention is way past the point where people will tune in
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J Brown
J Brown@JBrown_679·
@jake62372619 @UtilityCalc @GoodVibePolitik you said exactly that. that if we wait to endorse at the convention (which takes place 15 months before the general) that nobodies going to be paying attention. i think that’s ridiculous cuz most people won’t be paying attention until 2028 well after we’ve endorsed her
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J Brown
J Brown@JBrown_679·
@jake62372619 @UtilityCalc @GoodVibePolitik yeah people are gonna be so over the 2028 election by august 2027. i can’t believe i thought we could influence AOC’s campaign in a measly 15 months, i’m so sorry for my stupidity.
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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@JBrown_679 @UtilityCalc @GoodVibePolitik Multiple primary debates were held before August 2019 - if we wait until convention we will not be meaningfully involved until way past when no one is paying attention
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J Brown
J Brown@JBrown_679·
@UtilityCalc @GoodVibePolitik nobody’s saying to wait till 28, we’re saying to wait till 27, which will be just a couple months after she announces her campaign (if she’s running at all) and far before 99% of voters are paying attention. endorsing her with no promises beforehand is riskier than waiting
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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@aumyric @noahpasaran again, you can call people who disagree with you liberals and yourself the real leftist, so can we! Maybe I'm just more comradely I guess but we do have to decide how to move forward strategically, and voting is how we do so!
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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@BaseballIsFun5 @r0berto_mid_5 before 2016 DSA was tiny/not sure how ut was decided, but in 2020 there was indeed a (non-binding?) membership poll very soon after he announced, and then an independent DSA for Bernie expenditure campaign
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Jack
Jack@BaseballIsFun5·
@r0berto_mid_5 I’m new to the party - how does this process usually work. I’d imagine it’s just always been Bernie and there wasn’t much controversy but now there’s a few electable candidates within the party
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Roberto 🌹
Roberto 🌹@r0berto_mid_5·
I think the membership supporting AOC should mean DSA has to support her. Do we care about democracy or not? No, I don’t want the convention to decide. I don’t even want a nonbinding poll. Members deserve a binding poll. They are the only people that matter.
Sarah@Sarah_pdx

2. If we polled our membership, they would probably support AOC. I don’t think that means we have to support her, but I think that’s the real reason—or perhaps a reflection of the structural analysis behind the real reason— whether people want to poll members or chapters.

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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@substancepls @joewrote What's the excuse for the ultra orgs/strategy having been totally irrelevant for decades before the last 10 years too then? If your strategy requires no other leftist organizations to exist to work it's beyond impossible lol
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Carrie Matthews
Carrie Matthews@substancepls·
@joewrote Pretty tough to build that when DSA is out here running candidates in a rightwing genocidal party and telling people they're leftist if they just want healthcare and other public goods but don't challenge imperialism or even capitalism.
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Joe Wrote
Joe Wrote@joewrote·
I really appreciate Caitlin's work, but this is a very strange critique. DSA recently became the largest socialist party in American history. The ultra-left that abstains from effective electoral engagement barely manages to exist. If the electoral method had struggled over the last decade, and the ultra-left had built a revolutionary base amongst workers, tenants, or in anti-war protests, then they would have a leg to stand on. (No one will be “vindicated” until we achieve socialism.) But the opposite happened. DSA has ascended within and beyond electoral politics, while the ultra-left has fought among itself, splintered, and twiddled its thumbs.
Caitlin Johnstone@caitoz

Today some DSA person told me the best way to make changes in US politics is to work within the Democratic Party to elect left-wing candidates and advance progressive agendas. I said, "You guys have been trying that for ten years with nothing to show for it." I mean, how much longer is it going to take before people admit that the "change the party from within" strategy isn't working? Do you want another twenty years? Another fifty? Do you need to spend the next century watching a handful of vaguely progressive imperialists get elected to Congress and then getting primaried out by opponents with mountains of special interest funding before you admit that you're not making any meaningful gains? Our planet could be lifeless before then. The Bernie Sanders "revolution" was ten years ago. Large factions of the American left took up his call to take over the Democratic Party using primary elections throughout the nation, and ever since then it's been a two-steps-forward, two-steps-back addition of zeros. The people never got President Bernie, and the few progressive gains made on Capitol Hill were either kicked out like Cori Bush and Jamaal Bowman or went full pro-establishment like John Fetterman. The few who stuck around have turned out to be perpetually disappointing empire managers like AOC who know how to straddle the line between left-wing lip service and status quo swamp monster. It's time to admit the commies were right, kids. The factions on the so-called "far left" who've been rejecting electoral politics and calling for real revolution against a system designed to suppress leftward movement have been completely vindicated over the last decade. You cannot change the system using a political party that is designed to prevent change. The Atlantic has an article out by David Brooks titled "Democrats Became Great by Fighting the Left," and in a sense this claim is absolutely correct. It's not correct for the reasons David Brooks suggests, but it is correct that the reason the Democratic Party has been allowed to remain so dominant is because it is such an effective tool for thwarting all leftward political movement in the United States. In the article, Brooks (who last year published an article titled "The Epstein Story? Count Me Out" shortly before showing up in the Epstein Files) begins by rehashing the same tired old Hillary 2016 talking points arguing that the loony left is full of communists who must be forcefully opposed by the sensible center. What's more interesting is the brief history lesson that comes later, in which Brooks notes that after World War II the Democratic Party leadership took action deliberately "in order to block the leftward advance" toward socialism within its ranks. That's all the Democratic Party has ever existed to do. If it wasn't such a successful tool for suppressing leftward advancement, the party would not be permitted to exist as a mainstream political force by the capitalist oligarchs who run the country. It is the Democratic Party's job to prevent peace, equality, justice and socialism. That's the only reason it is permitted to exist in the hub of the capitalist empire, and that is the only reason why ten years of effort to change the party from within has produced no meaningful results. The experiment has been run, and the results are in. You can't conduct a socialist revolution using a party whose primary function is to suppress socialist revolution. This has been conclusively established. It's time to find another way.

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mug omar 🍺🍄
mug omar 🍺🍄@therealmugomar·
@thedemsocmarul There should be some point in between “several months before we even see exploratory committees” and “halfway through the primary” … a point like August 2027? Seriously how would primary campaigns be halfway through 6 months before Iowa??
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Bengü 🇵🇸🌹🕊️
Bengü 🇵🇸🌹🕊️@thedemsocmarul·
if you want dsa to fully control a presidential campaign why the fuck would you want the endorsement to be half way through the primary
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Diego
Diego@ComradeDiego·
Framing this as an ultra-exclusive thing when opportunists pushed out the Palestine Solidarity Working Group and defended someone seeking the endorsement of Democrats for Israel
molly 🌹@mxllysworld

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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@SarcasticMarx @escargotpro_ Don't think this is true - he was immediately unendorsed when it all started, the fight was over groups thinking that wasn't far enough and calling for expulsion no?
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daniel 🐌
daniel 🐌@escargotpro_·
50 chapters and one bad Seattle candidate Stephanie Gallardo put out statements trying to force NYC-DSA to not just unendorse but expel Jamaal Bowman lol what are you talking about. Also its a ridiculous to compare that to some *individuals* going to a fundraiser
James🔻@GoodVibePolitik

Imagining for a second what kind of hell would be raised by NYCDSA (his chapter) if other DSA chapters started stepping in antagonistically to interfere in NYC elections backing candidates NYCDSA did not support

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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@socialistem @rhodyDSA we just elected maybe the most popular politician in the country, used that to win a bunch more seats causing a huge membership boost, and people will still say this strategy doesn't work lol. Expelling Mamdani would be the first thing I would do if I were trying to destroy DSA
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Em 🏳️‍⚧️✊
Em 🏳️‍⚧️✊@socialistem·
DSA’s position in the Democratic party creates an irreconcilable contradiction. The more “successful” the DSA Democrats become, the more DSA is torn apart at the seams. In Rhode Island, NYC DSA is campaigning over the head of @rhodyDSA, which broke from the Democrats. In Indiana, a pro-Democrat faction of Central Indiana DSA is trying to expel an elected DSA councilmember @JesseForIndy for helping launch the Socialist Party of Indiana (after he was expelled from the Democratic Party caucus). There are increased calls for socialists like @cleanbreaknow within DSA to be expelled, in response to their unapologetic campaign to break from the Democratic Party. DSA’s leadership is being pulled further into the Democratic Party, while the left is being pushed out. The crisis won’t end until the contradiction is resolved. “Unity” inside DSA means unity with the Democrats (and capitalists). The left needs to fight back, make a clean break from the Democratic Party, and leave the DSA Democrats behind. That means no support for AOC, Mamdani, Chevalier, or anyone running in the Democratic Party. Expel Democratic Party officials from DSA. Fight to endorse @cmkshama, @GregLevy4Senate, @AndreEastonBX, and other independent socialist campaigns. Build unity between the DSA & non-DSA left. Build national support for the only independent DSA-backed campaigns, @brittanyforri and @BenDavisforIN.
James🔻@GoodVibePolitik

I can’t help but find it very weird that a leader of a major DSA chapter would support involving themselves in a race in Rhode Island to back a candidate who the local DSA chapter has rescinded the endorsement of. Beyond the precedent it sets it just seems bizarre to do.

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Business Unionism #1 Hater
Business Unionism #1 Hater@mtnsyndicalist·
DSA didn’t endorse Platner but many of their most prominent influencers/organizers did. And they were so smug about it too.
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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@hardlydying @UmbraSight @Sturnus_ @Wider_Ape0416 why can't we do that lol? good luck winning over the population to your extremely bleak dystopian view of the future, the real leftists here will keep pushing for a better world!
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Greyy 🪶🪂🔻
Greyy 🪶🪂🔻@hardlydying·
@UmbraSight @Sturnus_ @Wider_Ape0416 yeah it's much more realistic to guarantee 8 billion and growing people a house, a constant supply of food, an education, equal rights, AND a 4 day work week 👏👏👏 and why? so we can do the same thing on Mars of course
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Maria Danzilo
Maria Danzilo@Maria4Dist6·
@canarymission This is what a $40 million donation from George Soros to the working families party, which then channels into the DSA pipeline can create. They have plenty of money to hire people to do the work. This is not a grassroots operation. Far from it.
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Canary Mission
Canary Mission@canarymission·
NYC-DSA is not just growing. It is building the machinery to turn radical ideology into political power. The numbers show the scale: the largest DSA chapter in America, roughly 90,000 volunteers, hundreds of field leads, a candidate pipeline, and coordination that continues after Election Day. This is how a movement stops looking like protest and starts looking like infrastructure. New York is the testing ground. The machine is already being built.
Canary Mission tweet mediaCanary Mission tweet mediaCanary Mission tweet mediaCanary Mission tweet media
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jake
jake@jake62372619·
@OkGenocidBoomer absurdly bad faith, she supports cutting all military aid and that bill in question was literally to force the rules about not arming states committing human rights abuses to be applied lol
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👁️😷 DEATH2SLOPULISM🌹🔻
Alright look. I'll get with AOC 2028 - BUT if they try to steal the election / run third term / etc, then we all agree to pivot to running Zohran 2028
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