Jeff5647a

@Nathanielilee @iLLuminuttee @UAPGERB I think some would have needed to get it off their chest regardless of whether or not everyone would believe them.

The problem is even if they did would the public believe them? We've had whistleblowers, most have been mocked. Imagined if Snowden came out with what he did, having to spend the rest of his life constantly looking ove this shoulder, and the response from the public was a few days in the media, and most of the public snickering about what he revealed. Plenty of documents have leaked, just like Snowden, and most aren't taken seriously except for people already invested in the topic. The cover up has been so successful the public won't believe anything short of an alien corpse dragged out for people to gawk at.

"If we have literal space alien remain in the custody of the US Government, there is no way that wouldn't leak out in some way" - VP JP Vance “If there were aliens or alien spaceships or anything under the control of the United States government that we knew about — seen photographs, what have you — I promise you some guy guarding the installation would have taken a selfie with one of the aliens and sent it to his girlfriend.” - former president Barack Obama These jovial remarks by American leadership are not only untrue... coordinated UFO crash retrieval and reverse engineering programs have leaked for decades, culminating in David Grusch swearing under oath his knowledge of the Legacy Programs... but also show these men displaying a clear indifference to the secrecy apparatus built to protect Sensitive National Programs. The public is already ill-informed enough on the US's national security apparatus and I hope to see our leaders do better. Sensitive US National Programs are protected by a complex system of DoD Special Access Programs (SAPs), Intelligence Community Controlled Access Programs (CAPs), and National Security Council covert activity oversight umbrella Covert Action Programs (also Caps). Take SAPs for example - special national programs "established for a specific class of classified information that imposes safeguarding and access requirements exceeding those normally required for information at the same classification level.” SAPs come in three types - Acquisition SAPs (AQ-SAP), Intelligence SAPs (IN-SAP), and Operations and Support SAPs (OS-SAPs). These programs are built specifically for enhanced measures to protect national security - thus the number of personnel who have access to a SAP is kept to an absolute minimum, if an individual will not DIRECTLY or materially contribute to a SAP, that person does not have a NEED-TO-KNOW and is thus not granted access into the program. Furthermore, SAPs see 3 protection levels - acknowledged, unacknowledged, and waived. A Waived Unacknowledged SAP is one of the most secretive programs in the entire US National Program apparatus - with a classified or hidden budget and literally waived reporting requirements. SAPs have an entire ecosystem of governance, oversight, and access control with strictly defined roles on both the USG and contractor sides to maintain airtight security. This governance structure includes component-level SAPCOs, OSD-level SAPCOs, DOD-level SAPCOs, the SAPOC, the SRG, and the SSWG. Outside of all of that, SAPs can employ specific loopholes to COMPLETELY waive any and all reporting requirements, including making a White House non-covert action SAP (lives in a gray area between Title 10 and Title 50) and making a SAP "Content-Only" (essentially the SAP contains only Critical Program Information (CPI) and thus has no budget or reporting requirements.... a favorite of COG SAPs). Outside of CAPs, SAPs, and NSC CAPS, National Programs have an entire roster of loopholes and systems to hide activities that don't necessarily qualify as a SAP..... These include - ACCMs (Alternative Compensatory Control Measures) - MNTK (Managed Need-To-Know) Codewards and Constructs - DOE SAPs or SIGMAs (a whole other post) - waived or limited-distribution programs - waived or limited-distribution programs There have been some "leaks" or revelations of some extremely sensitive US programs/activities before. These include: - The UFO Legacy Programs - NURO: National Underwater Reconnaissance Office (This is an entire unacknowledged US Intelligence Agency that even seasoned Rear Admiral @GallaudetTim was not briefed on. Records of NURO can be found in declassified documents, not due to a leak) - ARMY SOD Yellow Fruit USAP (only exposed due to a series of general audits) In short, the US National Security apparatus does leak indeed, but is EXTREMELY robust.... To attack the UFO Legacy Program apparatus, it is key to understand how this activity set lives and thrives within sensitive US National Programs. President Vance, in 1983, Yellow Fruit was exposed due to a series of normal audits.... David Grusch says he PERSONALLY knows of a swath of misappropriation of funds used to fund these covert operations (self-funding, criminal enterprise, haircuts across programs, etc). Forget "space aliens" for a second and begin your foray into this topic by addressing these financial allegations. Also, Obama, if you think some guy is going to take a selfie with an alien, go see what happened when an INDUSEC officer took a selfie with a classified chemical nerve agent at Dugway Proving Ground. You know this individual would be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, so please do not use such a poor example.

I know the basics of Ryder and O'Donnell but I need to get up to speed on MEE. Appreciate the feedback. Yeah, Ryder and O'Donnell kind of count I guess but I'm thinking more about firsthand witnesses who speak directly and don't funnel their statements through others. Maybe these two did that and I don't realize it. I hear what you're saying about family feeling embarrassed, but I still feel like we should have heard more deathbed claims from direct firsthand witnesses. A lot (hundreds +) of scientists etc that worked directly on craft and bodies have died over the decades. Basically, they all didn't say jack shit even at the end of their life? Hard for me to believe.

That's why I say most wouldn't do it. If I made an oath, I wouldn't do it either. I'm just saying that given the hundreds (or thousands) of people who have had first hand information over the years and they know it's the biggest story in human history, that you'd think a few people would break from their oath on their deathbed, or leave compelling evidence to be disclosed after they die. What is the government going to do to you when you only have weeks or months to live? (like @rosscoulthart claims in In Plain Sight about Nat Kobitz) Philip Corso wasn't the kind of firsthand Legacy Program employee I'm talking about, but if what he said was true, even he said screw it and divulged what he knew late in life. Of all the firsthand witnesses who have worked on it since the 1940s and have since died, you don't think a few would have spilled their guts near the end of their life? It's human nature. 99% will keep their oath, but not 100%. There should be more. The fact that we don't have more doesn't make sense.

@jeff5647a @UAPGERB I don't think just throwing out a "F*** it" and giving out classified info is a reasonable expectation. That is treason. That can be punishable by life in prison and/or death. Doesn't just happen to you! It happens to your family...Your mom, your dad, your spouse and kids,& pets

Fun and fascinating conversation. Really enjoyed hearing all Ben's stories before he even got into the UAP sighting. Ben - thanks for coming forward to share. @uncertainvector - it has to make you feel pretty good that your congressional testimony played a big part in Ben feeling more comfortable sharing his experience. I hope you guys having this conversation gets more people to come forward.

"It looks like the size of a 737. Like, it's big." A Marine veteran and airline pilot recounts the Houston encounter that ended his skepticism, and why he tells fellow pilots not to stay silent. New episode of the Safe Aerospace Podcast, today at 1pm ET: youtu.be/uH_rX01-EoE

People who might disagree with my skeptical side might cite the hundreds of people who have seen or experienced something unexplainable (e.g. the 20+ 2001 Disclosure Project witnesses) or the Grusch and Elizondo types who have tesitfied to NHI under oath. I get it. The sheer number of people over the decades with more to lose than gain by sharing their story is what fascinates me with the topic and makes me 90% confident that some form of NHI is the cause for some of these claims. But what doesn't square for me are the hundreds (probably thousands) of people who, if this is true, would have been FIRSThand witnesses who worked on craft/bodies directly. This would be the biggest story in human history. And some of these folks would like it known to their family, friends, and the world that they were one of select few who were privy to firsthand involvement. So why don't we have some of these types who left statements of their involvement either just before they died, or to be unveiled after their death? We don't have that, and that doesn't make sense to me. It's one of the biggest reasons I'm 90% instead of 99-100%.

I mean I learned The Manhattan Project has 100,000 employees. Not all knew the real info, compartmentalized. But the communists did end up with a nuke in the end. So this isn't a secret like protecting the US from the Axis and Japanese empire, which many American's were 100% in for these types of secrets against out sworn enemy. But more akin to a new discovery that "may" offer a secret weapon. So I'd say even less of a built in oath breaking motivation. But that's all conjecture. Just seems like it would have leaked more than Lt Philip Corso, or S4 type Lazar stuff and the Jake Barber range they use to capture egg shaped UFO's for the USAF. Why weren't they killed?

The whole “I’d go to jail if I told you” excuse is bullshit to me. For the public to take these guys seriously, someone has to stop teasing breadcrumbs on podcasts and actually test the claim by revealing something that would supposedly land them in jail.

@dave_beaty @The_Astral_ The lack of deathbed confessions has always been a red flag for me. Most will honor their oaths but hard to believe more wouldn't divulge their knowledge of the greatest story in human history when death is near.

Plus some of the legacy guys would be in their 80s and 90s. The proof of visitation from extraterrestrials out weighs some security oath. Reason it never happened is because it doesn’t exist. Otherwise I predict it would have leaked as a confession years ago. People generate paper work. Jobs generate proof.

Catastrophic disclosure is happening NOW!

Agreed. I'm not sure Puthoff is on the same page with Burlison in this exchange. I think Burlison is simply talking about cracking into the Legacy Program simply to prove that NHI exist, since they allegedly already hold proof in the form of materials or biologics. Therefore let's not re-invent the wheel trying to prove it in the civilian sector. In his reply to Burlison, Puthoff says that he's not sure that the Legacy Program has the "answers". Maybe I'm misunderstanting Puthoff, but the way he talks it sounds to me like Hal is saying that the Legacy Program may not have figured out answers on how the materials/craft work, their origin, intent, etc. In short, it sounds to me like Burlison is talking about proof NHI exists while Puthoff is talking about answers on how the materials the Program has work.

I agree with Burlison. What I don’t like about civilian UAP science initiatives is that it’s defeatist: It says: “You know what? We have lost. We’ll never get disclosure from IC, from contractors, we’ll never see craft, biologics, we’ll never hear details. So let’s get “better data” with passive radar and cameras, and pretend like there aren’t ~1000-2000 people who have all the fucking answers. Let’s start over from Square 1.” Yeah, I’m with Burlison: uh, no thanks. Civilian science isn’t gonna ‘catch up to the program’. C’mon.

@TheUfoJoe It's cool how the shadows shoot up the rocks at the 34 second mark.

For a second, I thought this was gonna show Holloman Part 2! 👽

Not sure if it's been previously shared by Avi Loeb or others that several years ago a former Lockheed Martin high level executive visited Loeb's home. Regarding the allegation from @UapGerb that aerospace contractors like Lockheed Martin and Northrop Grumman established their own UAP retrieval and recovery activities and would self fund them through IRADs, Loeb said that several years ago a former Lockheed Martin high level executive visited Loeb's home and Loeb asked him if there's any truth to these claims. The former Lockheed exec answered "it's not wrong." On a different note, this type of response reminds me the response UFO researcher Kevin Randle got when he talked directly with Edwin Easley, Provost Marshal at Roswell Army Air Field in 1947 (Randle notes that as Provost Marshal, Easley would have had the ultimate responsibility for security at the alleged Roswell crash site). Randle asked Easley if he (Randle) and Don Schmitt were following the right path that Roswell was about something extraterrestrial and not something prosaic. Easley, who was secretive and valued his security oaths yet seemed to want to help Randle in his research, replied "Let me put it this way, it's not the wrong path." kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2018/08/edwin-…

What a stacked lineup... and I hear there is some new information discussed here too...

Taking a long break into the wilderness and completely unplugging from both cell and internet service for at least a few days is incredibly energizing. I've done it on on week long fishing trips in Canada and a bowhunying trip in Colorado. Although I don't bowhunt anymore, I can't wait for my next fishing or camping trip. If you've never unplugged like that before, you won't regret it.

I work around 100 hours a week between my day job and the podcast. I’m always going, going going and anyone who knows me knows this is the case. I’ve always had a hard time balancing, as I am very high energy and very go go go. I’m thinking it may be time for a camping Trip with no internet, no social media, just nature, my dog, and the open terrain.

Homer @espnhomer - if I remember correctly, you were pretty floored back in 2023 when David Grusch testified before Congress about UAP. You might be interested in what he shared today. Be sure to listen through to the Q&A. x.com/Reuters/status…

@conlin_lauren @TheUfoJoe Lauren - are you the person who asked Grusch the question about how many species he's aware of?

@TheUfoJoe YT! youtube.com/live/vnCTPRbyy…

🚨Heading to Capitol Hill today for what could be one of the most closely watched UAP/UFO events in years. UAP whistleblower David Grusch will join Reps. Anna Paulina Luna, Tim Burchett, Eric Burlison, Jared Moskowitz and others to call for the release of classified records involving UFO crash retrieval programs, non-human intelligence, biologics and reverse-engineering efforts. Grusch says it's time to move "from testimony to action" and let the American people see the evidence for themselves. I'll be there covering it live. Follow along for updates from Capitol Hill. @LAmag

@robjonesreports @Producer_Meagan @rosscoulthart Smart man!

@jeff5647a @Producer_Meagan @rosscoulthart No, some attempted to but David headed directly for his vehicle to head to the airport and go home.

Send me your questions for @rosscoulthart on this event and beyond.

@robjonesreports @Producer_Meagan @rosscoulthart Yep, understood, appreciate it. I imagine you and others wrangled Grusch and others for questions afterward, off camera, so look forward to hearing about what else was learned after the stream ended.

@jeff5647a @Producer_Meagan @rosscoulthart One of the questions was my own, we should be able to put together a better transcript later, not always possible in the moment of a media scrum but we will try!

Gorgeous area. Curious whatever came of the investigation a few years ago about Walton using lights from a fire tower to fake the whole story. You probably know the claim I'm talking about. The claims seemed to have some merit but I didn't dive deep and I still see his story referred to credibly by many UAP "researchers" and "experts." What is your take, Dan? Thanks in advance.

Driving through the forest where the Travis Walton encounter happened.

@0mega_Point In the race to compete for viewers, this is sure to set off UAP coverage by Dr. Oz, Dr Drew, etc. If only this could have all happened a few years sooner, because there's just something about the voice of Dr. Ruth discussing UAP that would have been priceless.

In hindsight, Dr. Phil disclosure was always the real disclosure.

@JudicialWatch Looking forward to upcoming additional discussion of this topic as mentioned by Chris.

NEW EPISODE: UAP Whistleblower David Grusch on “Non-human” Biologics & Craft YouTube: youtu.be/Q3BpTZXmDns Rumble: rumble.com/v79g2iu-uap-wh… Spotify: open.spotify.com/episode/2f7asR… Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/chr…