Moose in a bath 🇨🇦

@dhaaruni Idk. I think it's just that women tend to lean more liberal than men and guys don't want to immediately foreclose on a huge swath of potential partners that would be good matches in all other respects. I don't think there's anything sinister at play.

@NCBlake @MattBruenig @Noahpinion I am owning it. If someone is capable of working, unemployed, and collecting unemployment insurance, then its okay to judge them a bit. That's it. That's the argument.

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion My need? This is your argument! Own it

People don't enjoy their jobs. What they like is the idea that they have some sort of leverage over society, to *make* society give them food and shelter instead of just *begging* for it. That's why most people don't want to be on welfare, even if they'd have more *stuff*.

@NCBlake @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Ok? I'm sorry dispersed social decisions don't fit your need for firm definitions, I suppose.

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Cop out

@NCBlake @MattBruenig @Noahpinion No. Everyone gets to make there one call about when others actions deserve a bit of side eye. That's what makes it social

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Please, define for us where the line should stand before “social stigma” takes effect. Be as specific as possible.

@SukaruAnow @MattBruenig @Noahpinion I'm using it in the sense that Smith was using it in the OP.

@MattBruenig @mooseinabath @Noahpinion Why are we shifting the colloquial definition of welfare?

@brinkman_b @Deve_Dy @MattBruenig @Noahpinion I did not feel superior, I did feel embarrassed. If the other people don't feel the shame of it, this should give it a try. It's a good motivator for self improvement.

@dcmorgan @MattBruenig @Noahpinion You don't need to play dumb. Schooling is quite obviously different from unemployment. It's like on the job training which is contributing to society.

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion It's all stuff paid for by the government to benefit people who could be working. Kids could be working instead of going to school. Old people can still work instead of collecting SS.

@NCBlake @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Yeah, that's why there should be social stigma rather than cutting funding. It better captures the fuzzy edges

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion The issue is that the lines between “working” and “non-working” recipients of welfare usually aren’t as neat and tidy as the narrative suggests.

@BrigadeCorona @tomer_stern @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Sure but we all know that education makes people more productive down the line, it is contributing to society. We've agreed that its worth the investment. Same with on the job training. Being unemployed is different and I think you can tell the difference.

@mooseinabath @tomer_stern @MattBruenig @Noahpinion isn’t it for some of them? a 16 y/o can work

@Deve_Dy @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Poor people shouldn't feel bad. People that are able to work but don't should.

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Broadly speaking "poor people should feel bad" is not a priority for me

@Deve_Dy @MattBruenig @Noahpinion That's not what I'm talking about though? I'm talking about using welfare as an alternative to working and that should be shamed, yes

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Do we stigmatize getting free schooling? Emergency medical care? Old age care or disability insurance? Silly. Peoples careers too are subject to macroeconomic forces outside their control. Why be embarrassed, unless you did something wrong? Who

@tomer_stern @MattBruenig @Noahpinion That's not welfare as an alternative to working though...

@MattBruenig @mooseinabath @Noahpinion The welfare benefits to students is expected to be a fiscally net positive investment though

@PortmanToes @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Obviously, even more so. What kind of question is that?

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Do you think this stigma should apply to people who choose not to work because they have sufficient financial support from their parents?

@MattBruenig @Noahpinion But you do see how that's different from the actual subject at hand, right? This whole conversation is about people on welfare as an alternative to working. And that should be shamed. You can bring up other kinds of welfare if you want but that's not what this thread was about.

@mooseinabath @Noahpinion Both my parents are on Social Security. My uncle and grandmother are in Medicaid nursing homes. I suppose none of them are currently working though they have worked in the past.

@Deve_Dy @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Duh? I've been on employment insurance too. I was embarrassed by that fact and that's part of what motivated me to keep looking for work.

@mooseinabath @MattBruenig @Noahpinion Basically everyone is a welfare recipient at some point in their life, often pretty substantial ones. If you want to stigmatize people who "don't contribute to society" stigmatize anti-social industries like gambling or whatever, not regular people who are on hard times, or old

@MattBruenig @Noahpinion There should be stigma around not contributing to society. If you need welfare, fine, but it should be something that you're embarrassed about.

@Noahpinion Welfare aversion is rooted in social stigma around it indicating that you are some kind of loser or failure. People don't feel this way about all kinds of welfare (K-12 schooling, CTC, Social Security) only the welfare that is poor-associated.

Canada Post anyone?

@neontaster If you don't want a 30 minute call to hash out what specifically you need, then you're probably not their target market, and you'd be better off with a different company. The mistake is thinking commercial and industrial suppliers are the right fit for consumers.

The bane of my professional existence is companies that require a 30 minute zoom just to tell you how much their services cost.

There's something missing from the Hasan Piker discourse. Hasan's fans and critics often overlook the most troubling fact about him. The core problem with Hasan Piker is that, on a fundamental level, he doesn't believe in liberal democracy. x.com/CNLiberalism/s…