Alex Gordon

The problem is that is has to be correct today. Not when the model finally is tweaked to figure it out. So what other solution besides bringing max speed back fixes it right now? The model should not be determining speed until it never gets it wrong. And even then, until tesla is responsible for speeding tickets and insurance hikes as a result of them, the driver must always have the last word on speed control. In many places going 15 over is fine. By me, 10 over is risky. 7-9 is safe. So even in the case where the AI model never gets fooled by outdated map data, it still must obey some kind of speed offset defined by the responsible party

@agor117 @niccruzpatane Adding a limit is like going back to the old rule based code, not the way of AI and machine learning. I believe fixing the issue doesn’t mean map has to be up to date. Using reasoning plus better sign reading can solve this even if map data is wrong. Exactly what V14.3 is doing

Tesla FSD in Europe uses Max Speed Offset instead of Speed Profiles (Chill, Standard, Hurry, etc). Speed can be adjusted via the scroll wheel, and the percentage can be adjusted via the main visualization.

If you felt it drove too fast, you were always welcome to change the profile yourself. Now nobody has an option to do what they want. Personally this means I will never leave fsd on in the rain. Way too many spots with 8 month old map data where it thinks the speed limit is 55 but it's actually 70. I would be a hazard on the road going 57mph in a 70mph zone unless it was a monsoon

FSD V14.3 locks you into chill when it rains 🌧️ I absolutely love this! In V14.2 sometimes the car just drives a little too fast in the rain imo. This is a welcomed change. Some People may hate this as it may be “too slow” for some people, but it will be inherently safer. Plus they can always adjust this in future updates if it’s going too slow and it’s sprinkling for example!

The speed profiles suck. They rely on maps that are 8 months out of date on the ohio turnpike. There hasn't been construction on this stretch of road since August, but it thinks the speed limit is 50 here. Despite that, it continues going 82mph. If I switch down to standard, it goes 55mph. Actual speed limit is 70. I travel 35 miles each direction on the turnpike, and 10 of those miles each way have these phantom construction zones. Tesla must solve it by having maps that are never out of date, or giving us speed control. And not in a year, or some number of months, it must happen now. It's just ridiculous that the only way to go a reasonable speed and not impede traffic or get a speeding ticket is to drive manually.

@niccruzpatane I personally prefer to speed profile. Hard speed limit is not AI . Imagine a situation where FSD had to accelerate suddenly to avoid a collision. Slower doesn’t always mean safer.

I'll do you one better... the speed limit is NOT actually 50mph in that area. It's 70mph. It just shows up that way in the map data because there was construction there that ended 8 months ago. But, it *thinks* the speed limit is 50, and still proceeds to go 82. I cant even let the truck go this fast or I'll get a ticket, so it's this constant battle feathering between standard and hurry modes to try to keep the speed in a reasonable range. There are about 20 miles out of the 70 that I travel on the turnpike (35 miles each way) where the truck thinks the construction speed limits from last year are still in effect. So "standard" will always go 5-10mph under the posted speed limit, and hurry will speed up to 12 over the posted limit Honestly its easier to just drive the car myself than have to babysit the speed control so hard

Speed limit 60mph construction zone STANDARD: 75mph (15 over omg) Chill 62 (2 over... Seriously?) There has to be a better way.

@RjeyTech Trifold is best. Tall and narrow like fold 3 is also good. Passport is crap, square inner display is also crap

Passport form factor is the best imo.

All they have to do is let us submit complaints/feedback about the actual conditions. Every time I disengage because of that I leave a voice note. But clearly they dont care about those. Out of ~72 miles i drive on the ohio turnpike (36ish each direction), 20 of those miles have this phantom construction zones crap. They seem to add construction speed limits within a week or two. But they haven't removed them in 8 months since construction has ended in those areas

@agor117 @Michael_L_Rauch @Tesla Or even worse it thinks the limit is 55 but it’s really 40 so even sloth mode will get you a ticket. Your only option is to disengage. This is probably one reason why Cybertaxi is geofenced and requires Tesla to create its own maps.

Question: how is @Tesla FSD determining speed limits? Is it map based or camera based seeing signs? If vision why does it think it’s 35mph in this stretch after passing 4 signs showing 55mph? I had to push accelerator to get up to speed as I was annoying people behind me.

@jxrbot @patrickbennett @AIDRIVR You said 9mph over before. if I could lock this to 9mph over, and it didn't have weird incorrect map data, I would never complain about it. That would be perfect

@agor117 @patrickbennett @AIDRIVR I'll be honest, I'm highly biased by the fact that I really can't stand slow drivers, so I'm going to just try to stop talking about speed controls cold turkey.

husband buys wife Tesla so she can use FSD she turns it off and crashes 2 mins later there’s a lesson in here somewhere

I acknowledge it, but I don't care about any of that. If FSD isn't ready for prime time, don't overspend. Making hardware for software that isn't finished yet at the scale you are talking about is not an intelligent decision. I paid for FSD and I am not interested in my experience being worse so that they can make unsupervised work in a handful of cities. The promise of FSD is that it would work anywhere. But also, there is no reason they can't do both things. we had explicit speed control up to 13.2.9, so clearly it is possible to allow us to dictate the speed. This is the part that everyone keeps overlooking when they say "you shouldn't need to disengage because in my city I don't need to" or "I can make it go the speed I want because the model just goes that speed there". There is no reason that they can't do it both ways until speed control is perfect. They already have separate branches of FSD for supervised and robotaxi. Until every customer car is running the same exact branch of software as robotaxi, the argument that they only want to do one model doesn't even begin to make sense. I am a big tesla fan, I want to see them do well. But if every bit of (deserved) criticism to the brand is met with "here are the reasons why that isn't a problem" or "you are unreasonable for thinking that's a problem since nobody will be allowed to drive their car in 50 years", nothing is ever going to get better.

oh god, it's not going to be years. Where I drive, it's already better than what you experience. I can get it to 9 over, I've done it. Question- do you acknowledge or agree with the fact that Tesla will spend so much on capX in the next two years that if they don't have tons of robo taxis operating by end of 2027 they're basically dead? If you don't see it that way, of course you'll want speed control and look at this as an exercise to make supervised FSD enjoyable to use and a tool we'll have for years to come.

With no mechanism for correcting wrong speed limits in map data, there actually is no way to limit yourself to the speed limit without random periods going way below it. In those phantom construction zones I mentioned (construction ended in august), it would go 55-57mph in sloth/chill. The actual speed limit there is 70. Yet hurry mode will climb all of the way to 82 no matter how many times I switch down to standard and back (standard will drop the speed down to 60-65) This isnt like "oh it takes a few days to update the data after construction ends". It ended in August. Bug reports clearly dont go to fixing map data as I've submitted dozens. There is no current solution to this problem, and until there is, max speed should be brought back. There is no valid argument for just having a broken driving experience until months or years from now when all of these problems are fixed. Even taking manual control of the vehicle, there is no basic cruise control. You have to do a hacky workaround to use TACC and go back to FSD without parking the car. Until speed control is perfect, speed needs to be controlled by the driver.

@patrickbennett @agor117 @AIDRIVR you can go in chill or sloth and go the speed limit, or simply drive. so, yeah, need is a pretty strong word. That's only for small subset of people. Most of us don't even want them, let alone need.

I mean this is a little disingenuous. $500 to install a dryer outlet is very much "best case scenario". Some people may not have the overhead in their panel. Most, in fact. And "charged before you're done making dinner"? Especially on a limited dryer outlet you are only adding 20 miles back per hour. Less if it's winter and you aren't getting EPA estimated range. An hour of highway driving will take 5 hours to top off. If you had said its charged when you wake up, that's one thing. But by dinner assumes every best case scenario and that you barely drive anywhere

Many people are scared to get a Tesla because they think they need to spend $5000 or more to install a charger at home. No you don't. I charge my Tesla using a regular 240v outlet in my garage. Same outlet as a dryer. Your local electrician can install one for under $500. Your new Tesla already comes with a mobile connector that plugs right into it. If you want a Tesla Wall Connector, that's $450 and about $500 to install. Get home, plug it in, and by the time you finish making dinner it's fully charged. Charging at home can cost you under $3 a day. No more spending $60 a week on gas. The savings of driving an EV are HUGE and it starts on day one. What's stopping you from making the switch?

@MattTrades10X @AIDRIVR Hopefully when they fix speed control they'll come up with a way to keep people like you who pretend it currently is perfect to keep the poor speed control that presently exists

@agor117 @AIDRIVR Ok retard.

That's a cool story but that happened to me. One speeding ticket ever, 18mph over, my insurance premiums doubled. If i'm exaggerating it isnt by much. It went up at least 90%. 4 years later, I haven't gotten another one (nor had i ever had one before that) and my premiums have never gone down.

@agor117 @Scuba25 @AIDRIVR Not going to cause insurance to double from a single speeding ticket...

@jarrodzhang @Meh2662 @AIDRIVR If standard already goes below the speed limit in the circumstances I outlined above, how would picking an even slower profile help?

@agor117 @Meh2662 @AIDRIVR Have you tried sloth or chill modes?

The big picture is for everyone to live where speeding tickets arent a reality they have to deal with? FSD is supposed to be a generalized solution to autonomy. It isnt supposed to have an asterisk that says "except for where you have police that enforce the law" If there comes a day where tesla pays our insurance and speeding tickets, sure, the cars can drive however they want. But tesla takes no responsibility for anything. Then when people criticize how the system doesnt work right, and requires intervention to not get speeding tickets, the fanbois come out and say "have you tried considering that some people dont get speeding tickets?" Completely braindead. Until the liability and expense of speeding tickets (including insurance premiums spiking) shifts to tesla, the driver needs to have the final say on how fast the car goes.

@patrickbennett @agor117 @AIDRIVR They sure act like it’s everywhere though, and they all want a solution that’s not a good solution in the big picture.

@funandprofitco @scottbuscemi @Tesla_AI That would be great if it still worked that way but 15 over where I live is a huge ticket. We need a mode that always goes 5 over and one that always goes 10 over. None of this crap where it will go 25 in 35 on hurry and then speed up to 50mph when it feels like it

@scottbuscemi @Tesla_AI A few months back it was pretty reliable that standard = 5mph over, and hurry - 15mph. This actually worked on highways where I live, but Mad Max absolutely would have gotten me a ticket. I think 14.2.2 was where it changed? Not sure.

> FSD Hurry mode is going 25 MPH over the speed limit > switch to Standard > goes 3 MPH over There *has* to be a better answer @Tesla_AI. Really hope FSD 14.3 helps with speed profiles.

There is no exact rule that FSD follows. It decides how fast it feels like going and the speed limit is a guideline rather than a rule. I have been 10 under on standard on city streets quite often. I've also had standard go 15 over though its rare. Hurry will often go 20-25 over though, when it should be 10 max

@agor117 @AIDRIVR That's false I own a new Tesla model y you can change how it drives in the settings. Sloth mode goes the exact speed limit and chill goes about 2 miles while standard goes about 5 miles over.

@CSP_Trading @tsmbuck @AIDRIVR Yes but HW3 cars have max speed amd HW4 cars don't. They haven't since v14. "Latest update" doesnt mean anything in this context because HW3 cars are on v12 while HW4 cars are on v14

@tsmbuck @agor117 @AIDRIVR always install latest updates, also checked my sisters car (she just bought it and has the latest software/hw) and she has the same functionality. idk why ur lying about this, either that or youre just stubborn and too lazy to check

@DirtyTesLa It's even worse when the construction ends and the map data doesnt update. A few near me ended in August. It thinks its 55mph in the map data and it's 70mph. Standard goes 60, hurry goes 82. 82 is a ticket near me for sure

@Scuba25 @AIDRIVR Honestly depends on the damage. One speeding ticket often causes insurance to double for many years.

@agor117 @AIDRIVR A ticket is cheaper than repairing the car.